Pilot at fault used Profiling against SS Agent

CNN - Crossfire Transscript 1/4/2 ^ | 1/4/02 | Self

[ImphClinton]

Here's one from Karen who's from upstate, New York. Big territory. "Bill, I almost always agree with you, but you are really wrong on this one. The pilot did exactly the right thing. And anyone who believes a government ID cannot be forged is living in a fantasy."

[fellowpatriot]

That's easy to say in hindsight. The pilot's concern was for the safety of his passengers. In light of what happened on the Paris flight, as well as the others, I think the pilot did the right thing. Too bad if this agent's ego was bruised in the process - we're not living in the same world that we were prior to 9-11.

[ImphClinton]

This says it all. BTW, just how long would you hold up a couple hundred passengers while you made phone calls to check this guy out? After waiting for him to try THREE times to fill out the forms?

He had 90 minutes before the plane was scheduled to take off. He made no attempt what-so-ever to verify this Agent's identity. He lied about the agent geting abusive. He lied about the form. The agent claims the form was filled out correctly and the airline has not provided evidence otherwize. The original form was for his original flight and changed by the American Airlines Agent at the gate who could not find a new form so crossed out the flight number and wrote in the new flight number. In fact it is not even clear the form was supposed to be filled out by the agent or the airline, although it was an airline form.

[Bogey78O]

The first thing I would have done is call the White House. I would have done this before saying anything to the agent. The number is not exactly hard to find as it is in every phone book in the United States and many foreign countries

"Hello, this is the US WhiteHouse auotmated voicemail system. Please listen to all the options and press the appropriate button.
Press 1 to schedule an appointment for the next WH tour.
Press 2 to obtain a signed autograph of President George Walker Bush
Press 3 to do a background check of all active Secret Security agents."

[Cultural Jihad]

I believe he did this on purpose to cause Bush problems then made sure the situation got reported in the news.

Naw. We all thought that was the reason for your post! LOL! Seriously, if you can gaze into a CNN panel discussion and see the hidden motivations of an AA pilot you have never seen or met, then maybe you ought to join our Remote Viewing Club here at Langley. We'll be in contact soon.

[Gee Wally]

It is truly mind-boggling that you accept the self-serving statements of some high-priced shill. His job is to twist, contort, hide, shade and otherwise distort the facts so he can bamboozle a jury (or worse, yet, get a favorable ruling from some judge who plays along with the game).

Whatever the facts may be, we can rest assured that once the trial lawyers get ahold of them, we will never know the truth.

[Bogey78O]

'He lied about the agent geting abusive. He lied about the form.'

The lawyer says so so it must be true. Clinton says he never got a hummer. Can you prove he did? His lawyer says no so obviously Republicans were lying.

[McGavin999]

Really? Were you there? Are you so sure he didn't get abusive? Then why do you suppose he told the pilots supervisor that he lost his temper?

[ImphClinton]

Did he make any attempt to verify the agents identy.
No, he didn't have to!.

FAA regulations require that paperwork be checked with the law enforcements supervisor if there are any questions about a person's identity. The number can always be had through directory assistance. This would have beed far quicker than having the agent fill out one of his companies forms three times.

It is late here sorry about my earlier miss spealings.

[Bogey78O]

Read the security agent for AA's report. But you haven't read that have you?

[ImphClinton]

No the agent did not admit to being anything other than professional. The supervisor did say in his response that the pilot and their security man said he was. But then again would you expect American Airlines to admit they kept this legitimate Agent off the plane because of racial profiling.

One thing that is not debateable is this Agent was who he claimed to be. I know of no one who has not been threatened by some pilot or employee when complaining about an airlines miss doings.

[Nitro]

FAA regulations require that paperwork be checked with the law enforcements supervisor if there are any questions about a person's identity.
Pilots are not Law Enforcement!

The number can always be had through directory assistance.
If he was a real Secret Service Agent he should have had the number memorized and a cell phone at hand!

This would have beed far quicker than having the agent fill out one of his companies forms three times.
As I understand it, the "agent" answered the forms differently each time!

It is late here sorry about my earlier miss spealings.
I would be Mr. spealings!!

[ImphClinton]

Read the security agent for AA's report. But you haven't read that have you?

Absolutely. This is the one where the pilots subpervisor says the pilot asked him to fax over pictures of Terrorist. Then later claims he didn't know the agent was Arabic. The company claims it was not Racial Prifiling while complaining about the agents Mid East History book. The pilot that only tells his supervisor the agent is abusive in another call a few minutes after the supervisor suggest calling the White House. The one where the pilot answers the Agent "Tell Him...." The pilot wouldn't even talk to this agent by his own admission.

[McGavin999]

"The police agreed with me that there was a legitimate concern because of his unprofessional behavior," the pilot reported. The operations manager, in a separate report, said a police officer confirmed the pilot's account.

from this article AP Article

[Bogey78O]

He asked for pictures of known terrorists. He didn't ask for pictures of arabian men. It's quite obvious the pilot put 2 and 2 together and figured. "Hey.... maybe if this guy isn't an agent maybe he might have a security file".

[ImphClinton]

In American Airlines version on theri web site the pilots supervisor says the pilot told him to not trust the phone number the agent provided. The pilot only talked to the agent through his crew. The pilot talked his supervisor out of calling the Secret Service to verify the Agents identity.

I believe after the fact this agent acted correctly. There is no indication that he leaked the story. I believe the Pilot leaked it. He never spoke to the press directly. He speaks through an attorney now so he can go about and do his job. He will lose his job if he is lieing while the Pilot will not. The pilot is protected by his Union this Agent has no protection.

Untill the facts show otherwize I will believe the Agent. Besides based on the facts avaiable so far AA's tale makes little sense.

[Cultural Jihad]

In reality, no one really cares what your opinion is of what happened. This event will be closely reviewed and scrutinized by the proper authorities as well as by the liberal sharks the agent hired, so your endless conjecture and guessing is really immaterial.

[Howlin]

There is no indication that he leaked the story.

ROFLMAO. Surely you don't believe that.

The first thing the agent did was call an Islamic group.

Do you even KNOW who his attorney is? Do you know how many of these cases these attorneys have worked on?

You need to get your facts together.

The agent should be fired.

[ImphClinton]

And I guess you would have never asked what the man looked like? After being asked for pictures. Had he been white there would have been very few pictures to fax. This is implausible. Terroist for the most part are Arabs. I believe they should be looked at closely ever very closely. However that alone should not be enough. My problem is the White Houes is easy to contact. I have called there several times and have always gotten immediate attentition, the phone never ringing more than three times. Once about a security matter that was not taken the least bit lightly. This pilot did not protect the rest of the people in this Airport as he let the Agent and his gun off the plane. Had he really been a terroist, was this responsible???? How many people could he have shot on another plane or in the concourse?

[The Westerner]

It does make some sense. What kind of judgment was he using when he suddenly deplanes. This is post-911. This is high alert. The flight attendant had to be extra careful. Especially since he was an Arab looking man (I'm assuming.) I'm sure the new security procedures required her to look at his seat to see whether he left any suspicious parcels behind. She finds a history of the Arab world. Red flags are raised in her mind. She immediately notifies the Captain. He decides to doublecheck the guy's paperwork. Had the Agent not deplaned, probably the paperwork wouldn't have been scrutinized. I'll just add one last thing. Don't you think that this same agent and all of our President's agents do racial profiling while scanning crowds every day?

[Nitro]

Here is the bottom line!!

A pissed off Secret Service Agent is better than a crashed aircraft!!

Period...end of story!!