Posted on 12/23/2001 4:21:04 PM PST by blam
Uranium and cyanide found in drums at bin Laden base
By Barbie Dutter in Kandahar and Ben Fenton
(Filed: 24/12/2001)
URANIUM has been found in an al-Qa'eda base outside Kandahar - the first evidence that Osama bin Laden had obtained materials for a nuclear arsenal, it was revealed yesterday.
The discovery gives some credibility to the fear that he could unleash a weapon of mass destruction as his dying act.
Anti-Taliban leaders in Kandahar revealed that the uranium and other materials, including cyanide, had been discovered in a tunnel complex beneath the former base near the city's airport. The find was confirmed by American officials.
It was also revealed that when tribal forces took the al-Qa'eda complex earlier this month they found hundreds of jars, drums and metal cases in an underground labyrinth at the desert compound where Arab fighters staged a bloody last stand before Kandahar was surrendered by the Taliban.
The cache included low-grade uranium 238, which could be used to make a so-called "dirty bomb" if wrapped around a conventional explosive. It would spread radiation over a large area.
Specialised equipment and facilities would be needed to turn uranium 238 into a fissile device like the Hiroshima bomb, and so it would not be suitable for building such a weapon.
American intelligence officials told Newsweek magazine that al-Qa'eda had enough of the material to make a "dirty bomb" and it seems certain that their knowledge is based on the discovery at Kandahar airport.
Haji Gullalai, now the interim intelligence chief for Kandahar province, told The Telegraph that immediately after capturing the airport area, his men had entered one tunnel and discovered the materials in a vast underground workshop.
The find was reported the same day to "international military personnel", thought to be American special forces, who sent experts wearing masks and protective clothing to examine the substances, Mr Gullalai said.
He added: "We knew we were not well equipped to deal with these things so we called in foreign experts who told us it was uranium.
"For our own safety we did not touch the bottles but from a distance we saw there were hundreds of different kinds of containers - small jars and big jars, sealed with metal lids and containing powders and liquids, white and yellowish in colour.
"There were big drums the size of petrol drums and metal boxes with sides seven or eight inches thick. The bottles were labelled in four different languages - Chinese, Russian, Arabic and English."
American officials said that Russia, the states of the former Soviet Union, China and Pakistan were all possible sources for the uranium.
It has been estimated that several hundred Arab al-Qa'eda fighters were killed in the battle for the airport, led by Gul Agha - now Kandahar's new governor - with Mr Gullalai playing a senior commanding role.
The area where the tunnels were found is known locally as Turnak Farms. It is thought to have been the al-Qa'eda network's principal training and military base in southern Afghanistan and and held up to 1,800 people.
Kandahar airport has now been taken over by around 1,500 US marines and coalition forces.
Complete bovine scat. U-238 is as common as tin or tungsten, and more or less as dangerous as either. The radiation it emits is alpha particles, which cannot penetrate clothing, skin or anything else thicker than a sheet of paper. M-1 tankers ride into battle surrounded by tons of U-238, and while some people connect that to "Gulf War Syndrome," the possibility of inflicting chronic fatigue syndrome on a handful of people ten years from now is hardly worth a suicide bomber's time.
"Specialised equipment and facilities would be needed to turn uranium 238 into a fissile device like the Hiroshima bomb..."
Oh, I get it—this is one of those fabled British understatements. Replace "specialed equipment and facilities" with "years of research and development, the scientific and intellectual resources of an entire university physics department and an assortment of processing equipment extremely bulky and difficult to hide." U-235, the uranium isotope that is actually capable of killing people and breaking things, is much harder to produce than even plutonium. Iraq can't do it, North Korea can't do it—why would anyone believe al-Qaeda can do it?
Some people remind me of my canary, always looking for a reason to be afraid, sounding the alarm and spreading panic.
From reading #20, 61 & 62, we simply uncovered garbage, and this place is to an effective dirty bomb as a junkyard is to a Lexis.
Osama took his absolute very best shot, and it was only enough to wake us up. The next several years will just be a giant mop-up operation, chasing fleeing terrorists and minimizing the quivering dictatorships that once gave them significance. Dangerous but manageable.
And BTW, anyone notice that it was a woman that took down their last terrorist? I smile every time I think of that fact sinking into their sympathizers!
Although it is prudent to maintain domestic vigilance (and reports indicate our government is beginning to do so at shipping ports and certainly in Manhattan and DC), I don't recall that bin Laden actually said that he had nukes. More accurately, he said it would be the duty of Islam(ists) to acquire nuclear weapons, and he has not directly stated that he did or do not have them. Unless I missed something.
Ridicule has its place. I remember working with a guy who began carrying around "Dianetics" and telling everyone how interesting it was. Rather than get into a long discussion (which would have been impossible anyway) I began to call him "L-Ron."
After a couple of weeks he stopped carrying the book around. Hopefully I saved him from spending thousands of dollars in getting "clear."
1) We know that he does have nuclear (read Fissionable) material (FM). This doesn't mean he has weapons grade FM, nor does it mean that he has a detonation system. Let us now assume that he has both.
2) He would need to "air detonate" a the device in order to get maximimum effectiveness of the weapon. Ground detonation would make a big hole, in a small area, and the readioactive contamination would be pretty much contained to that area. Yes it would kill and wound many (in a major metro area 2 to 5 thousand people).
3) The most logical way for him to do this, since he has a suicide squad at his disposal, is to use a light aircraft (Cessna 150/180) and a barometric trigger. This could be accomplished by the following scenerio: Two men and the device in a Cessna 150. The plane takes off and get to it's max altitude (about 9000 feet). At this point the devise is armed and the barometric trigger is set for 1500 feet. This would take a considerable amount of time. Both the ballistic implosion mechanism and the barometer trigger devise would need to be attached and set, at an altitude well above the 1500 foot ingition altitude. Only one man could be working on the devise because the other would have to fly the plane. As I recall, from my old pilot days, a 150 doesn't come with an auto pilot (that's been years age though).
You can imagine the rest!
There are good reasons that I have posted this, so don't get excited. First, I think they have thought of this already. If they are lurking and read it here then I know, that they know, that we have already figured this out. Second, I don't think they have the capability.......YET! If they have this capability and are waiting to use it then this directly can be traced to Iraq/Iran, these are the only radical Islamic states that could supply all the parts necessary for the device.
Putting all those facts into context I believe all my fellow FReepers could figure out a proper US response......Lots of "glass making". Our response would take out about a fourth of the radical Islamic world and would be a STRONG warning to the ones that are "survivors".
There you have it.........my 2 cents!
1) We know that he does have nuclear (read Fissionable) material (FM). This doesn't mean he has weapons grade FM, nor does it mean that he has a detonation system. Let us now assume that he has both.
2) He would need to "air detonate" a the device in order to get maximimum effectiveness of the weapon. Ground detonation would make a big hole, in a small area, and the readioactive contamination would be pretty much contained to that area. Yes it would kill and wound many (in a major metro area 2 to 5 thousand people).
3) The most logical way for him to do this, since he has a suicide squad at his disposal, is to use a light aircraft (Cessna 150/180) and a barometric trigger. This could be accomplished by the following scenerio: Two men and the device in a Cessna 150. The plane takes off and get to it's max altitude (about 9000 feet). At this point the devise is armed and the barometric trigger is set for 1500 feet. This would take a considerable amount of time. Both the ballistic implosion mechanism and the barometer trigger devise would need to be attached and set, at an altitude well above the 1500 foot ingition altitude. Only one man could be working on the devise because the other would have to fly the plane. As I recall, from my old pilot days, a 150 doesn't come with an auto pilot (that's been years ago though, so correct me if I'm wrong).
You can imagine the rest!
There are good reasons that I have posted this, so don't get excited. First, I think they have thought of this already. If they are lurking and read it here then I know, that they know, that we have already figured this out. Second, I don't think they have the capability.......YET! If they have this capability and are waiting to use it, then this directly can be traced to Iraq/Iran, these are the only radical Islamic states that could supply all the parts necessary for the device.
Putting all those facts into context I believe all my fellow FReepers could figure out a proper US response......Lots of "glass making". Our response would take out about a fourth of the radical Islamic world and would be a STRONG warning to the ones that are "survivors".
There you have it.........my 2 cents!
A law enforcement official said in recent weeks the government had warned airlines that potential hijackers might try to smuggle weapons in their shoes, though officials wouldn't say what intelligence prompted the warning.
The Federal Aviation Administration on Sunday issued a circular that discussed Saturday's incident and provided guidance to airlines.
Some people remind me of ostriches with their heads in the sand, blinded and overconfident they are easy prey.
Wrong. He stated in an interview on Al Jazerra TV shortly after 9/11 that Al Qaeda did in fact have nuclear and biological weapons, but that they would only be used if the United States attacked with weapons of mass destruction. If you search FreeRepublic I am sure you will find some posts.
My guess is that someone came up to them, said "psst, wanna buy some uranium to strike a blow agains the Great Satan?" They said "sure!" and got delivered this worthless stuff. It's been established that these guys aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer—getting sold a bill of goods is totally in character for them.
Alternately, maybe one of their less intellectually stunted members said "hey, all this stuff they say about how hard it is to enrich uranium must just be Zionist propaganda. After all, if Jews can do it, how hard can it be?" So they acquired some U-238 and a couple of nuclear chemistry textbooks and gave it the ol' jihadist try for a while before giving up.
I guess it's possible that they had some Evil Scheme in the works, but I can't imagine what it would have been. There might be some toxic chemical compound possible with uranium, for all I know. But their plan wouldn't involve U-238's radioactive properties, because it doesn't have any to speak of.
That's because the Tyson Chickens of the world won't survive with out them....
The government's (both parties at every level up to and including Bush) blind eye to illegals has redefined "free market" and "let the market decide", remember that the next time you hear the "free market", "let the market decide" mantra from the corporate puppets...Oh yea and don't forget it's all because of Unions and those evil high wages we need demand.....
And if the Telegraph's little BS lie by omission scare piece wasn't totally refuted by #20, 60 & 61, you might have a point. Dirty bombs are a real concern, but al-Queda's in no position to deliver one that will do as much damage as 911. And promoting them as being capable of it, gives them power. That's doing exactly what they want of you.
Looks like it was. I posted the follow-up information on this earlier thread.
Thanks!
I dunno. Cyanide is used in precious-metal (gold) mining, to leach the metal out of the ore.
--Boris
Thanks, I figured (hoping) someone in the know would come along and keep us straight.
If this is the only article on which you base your asessment of Al Qaeda's nuclear capability then you are in worse shape than I thought. There have numerous of articles from dozens of sources on this topic. They speak of nuclear suitcases, Pakistani nuclear scientists, powerful Russian Mafia figures, sympathetic Chechneyan sepratists, and hundreds of instances of nuclear smuggling since 1991. Taken as a whole they paint a picture of Al Qaeda's well financed and single minded effort to obtain nuclear weapons.
Are you aware that Iraq for example with sufficient black-market HEU has EVERYTHING necessary to make an atomic bomb? What do you suppose Sadam would do with it once constructed? Test it? Maybe give it to Al Qaeda to test against the United States?
"We have the weapons as deterrent," he added.
The interview appeared in Pakistan's Dawn newspaper.
The paper said that when asked where he got the weapons, Bin Laden replied, "Go to the next question."
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