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To: Aric2000
I am sorry Whiskey papa, but you are so WRONG about Lincoln not willing to put up with Slavery, since everyone loves to use lincoln quote, I will use on as well.

Preservation of the union was Lincolns primary goal in the civil war, 1861-1865. it was"not either to save or to destroy Slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that."

Here is a more complete quote. Funny how the neo-confederates never seem to make a complete quote of this oft-quoted letter.

"I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be would would NOT save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and not to either save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do that, and if I could save by freeing some and leaving others alone, I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forebear, I forebear because I do not think it will help save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe more will help the cause. I shall endeavor to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.

I have herein stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personal wish that all men everywhere could be free."

A. Lincoln 8/22/62

The main thing to keep in mind regarding Lincoln is that his bedrock position was that slavery NOT be allowed to expand into the territorries. He never deviated from this. That --was-- enough to set the slave holders off, however. Lincoln's name did not even appear on the ballot in South Carolina and several other southern states. Seven states passed secession ordinances or otherwise attempted to overthrow the federal government within their boundaries before Lincoln even took office. It's unrealistic to say Lincoln, given the conditions of his time, should have immediately said upon taking office, that he demanded an immediate emancipation of all slaves when seven states were attempting to form a separate nation.

Lincoln in this time frame didn't favor immediate emancipation in any case, unless it was coupled with repopulating blacks outside the country. That is the fact of the matter. On the other hand, as the war progressed Lincoln said:

"When you give the Negro these rights," he said, "when you put a gun in his hands, it prophesies something more: it foretells that he is to have the full enjoyment of his liberty and his manhood."

And later:

"it is also unsatisfactory to some that the elective franchise is not given to the colored man. I would myself prefer that it were now conferred on the very intelligent, and on those who serve our cause as soldiers."

4/11/65

Note the date. It was over this speech that Booth vowed to kill Lincoln, and three days later, he did.

So Lincoln's ideas grew and changed over time. Those that would attempt to besmirch Lincoln's memory typically want to focus on Lincoln's comments during the 1850's and exclude what he said as president because it doesn't suit them. The record shows that by the end of his life, Lincoln was coming to the conclusion that blacks deserved ALL the rights of citizenship.

Your position, as I like to say, is not well supported in the record. If you continue to spout the sort of complete nonsense some do, I will say more.

I will also point out that this famous letter to Greeley you butcher was written in just the same time frame that Lincoln decided to issue the Emancipation Proclamation.

Walt

246 posted on 12/19/2001 10:53:23 AM PST by WhiskeyPapa
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To: WhiskeyPapa
Yes, the emancipation proclamtion that did NOTHING to free ANY slaves whatsoever, it was nothing but a worthless piece of propaganda. He was hoping that the southern slaves would rise up and revolt and finish the south off for him. It did not work.

The emancipation Proclamation is a WORTHLESS document, it did NOT free one slave in the North, which is where he had power to do that, and there were over 4,500,000 slaves held there. It only released the 3,000,000 held in the south, of which he had no legal authority.

Notice that the majority of the slaves were held within the union? Yep, he cared about slavery a lot!!

Lincoln was a tyrant and a Traitor to the constitution!!
247 posted on 12/19/2001 11:00:12 AM PST by Aric2000
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