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To: Dr. Octagon
There you go again, saying it's the women's fault! Hmmmm? If your wife takes advantage of you - whose fault is that - HERS???? or the dummy who let her. Maybe if the husband would look more closely at what kind of person he's marrying, instead of what kind of body he's marrying, he wouldn't get taken to the cleaners so often.

Sorry, your argument doesn't hold water. Since God wrote the Bible, He has not changed his mind; He still holds the husband responsible for the relationship! I guess my Pastor is the only one willing to preach the truth to husbands.

277 posted on 12/16/2001 1:25:14 AM PST by Sueann
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To: Sueann
Where husbands have the authority the Bible advocates, they should have the responsibility advocated there, also. Where the feminist legal system undermines his authority by offering his wife advantages in divorce, we have a different scenario.
279 posted on 12/16/2001 1:30:21 AM PST by Dr. Octagon
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To: Sueann;woahhs;wwjdn
For what does your Pastor hold wives responsible?
282 posted on 12/16/2001 1:36:06 AM PST by Dr. Octagon
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To: Sueann
I agree, the husband to be should take a better look. Had I done so, I would not be in my third marriage, I would have married my wife 20 years sooner.

That said, I have found that a great deal of our society curently places great value on deception. What was once makeup or a little lipstick has grown into an industry of enhancement, liposuction, rhinoplasty, orthadonture, collagen treatment. Superficial deception has become the norm, and with it, the bar has been lowered for deception on other levels as well.

Neither of my first two spouses were honest with me, nor could they be, I realize in retrospect, simply because they were incapable of being honest with themselves.

After my second divorce, I took a few years to root and dig, not only for the causes of those marriages failure in my ex wives, but in myself as well. There are few who made no mistakes, who did nothing wrong. I know where I failed, but even if I had not, a marriage takes, on occasion, the concerted effort and will of both parties. In the absence of that, the marriage will fail.

Neither were raving knockouts, in fact, both were rather plain. I failed to discern the 'early warning signs of marital incompatibility' in both cases.

For the benefit of others, those early warning signs:

1) Credibility: Do they make a habit of saying one thing and doing another? Does the story change? Are there significant inconsistencies in their descriptions of past events? How much of their past is polished to make them look better? to make others look worse?

2) What is their attitude toward their ex-spouse (in my age group, that is there in most cases)? Why? Is it justified, or is it a rationalization? (NOTE: this one is tricky, guys, a lot of guys/girls seem one way around 'the guys/girls' but are another critter around--or to a person of the opposite sex.

3) What are their priorities? List them by time/money spent. Do they have any incompatible compulsive behaviors?

4) Where are their kids? Do they put the children ahead of you when the children need it? All of the time? Never? Are the kids in trouble? For what, where? What attitude do their children have toward them? Why? Are the children trotted out for show and then sequestered or are they active participants in the developing realtionship? Are they being used to bait the hook? Do they denigrate their ex in front of the kids?

5)How do they treat the hired help, or other people of the same/opposite sex who know you? Shoddy treatment of undeserving waitresses, clerks, etc. shows a lack of civility which may run deeper than those they consider inferior. What are they saying about you behind your back? Are they blatantly two-faced in thier dealings with others? Do they leave a decent tip or protest when you do? Do they feel threatened by your few close friends--or do they get along well?

6)Are they scrupulously honest? Lying about little things indicates a tendency to bend the truth when convenient. Small dishonesties lead to greater ones. This comes with a caveat: Don't ask the question if you do not want to know the answer. Most of the past's details belong there.

7)Can they be genuinely happy for someone else's triumphs or good fortune? Even if they were competing for the same thing (like a promotion?)What will their attitude be if you do well? Vice versa?

8) Will they tell when they think you are wrong? Right? Will they admit, gracefully to an error? (Can you?)

9) Do you have common and differing interests. One provides a basis for discussion, the other provides room to learn and grow.

10)Are your political/religious/philosophical beliefs compatible? Not can you 'bring them around?', but compatible now.

Put all of this in the context of an impending relationship, and many will not get far past the first date. Aside from a few physical parameters, the essence of good sex is communication, and that can/will (perhaps) come later. As you get older, that loses some of its urgent priority anyway, other factors take precedence.

297 posted on 12/16/2001 2:19:46 AM PST by Smokin' Joe
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