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To: knighthawk
With the first post you mean

It's a comment on the general situation in the Netherlands, sort of - which that outrage is only a result of.

It's as someone else here commented, the criminals are getting plush "prisons" and the victims are getting the real prison stuff. Example: private ownership of guns is to all intents and purposes banned there, and if you should harm an assailant you will likely go to jail. That is, in fact, not uncommon in Europe, but most of Europe has somewhat less insane laws on gun ownership. Their laws tend to be fairly bizarre, though - such as odd pistol calibers because civilians may not be allowed to own calibers also in use by the military or police.

I have discussed gun laws with a few Netherlanders. They tend to get me upset. They also seem to think that being sheep is the most desirable state in the world..

35 posted on 12/03/2001 1:58:18 PM PST by Cachelot
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To: Cachelot
First post: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/fr/573603/posts

Yes, in Holland it is illigal to defend oneself effectively. But it is legal (after you got a weapon-permit) to own military weapons, but not automatic ones. You can buy AR-15's (XM-15 Bushmasters), H&K Mk-23's (SOCOM USP) and Steyer AUG's over here. 9x19 mm para, .45 APC, .223, and .30 nato/.303 winchester are all allowed in the Netherlands, but .50 BMG is not (except when you are able to get a special permit, for testing armored cars)

Well, after talking to these guys you know why Holland is in military aspect laughable! Our police is armed with Walther P5's, but many officers never use them (you almost have to get written permission from the governement to shoot back in a firefight), they almost got no gun training and don't care for their P5's (dropping them or never cleaning them) so many of the P5's simply don't work.

45 posted on 12/03/2001 2:37:22 PM PST by knighthawk
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