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To: afraidfortherepublic
The constitution is a document designed to limit the power of government, it details HOW it should work, and the specific reponsibilities of each branch. IOW, it is an employee manual for public servants. The Bill of Rights again addresses the government telling them VERY specifically what rights are not up for discussion, they are ours and "Congress shall make no laws..."

The short answer lies in the Declaration of Independence. Where the constitution is a practical document, the Declaration deals with principles, and beliefs, the ideas drove the Founders to revolt. I don't think that you can read one without the other.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by God with certain unalienable rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness..."

Rights are granted by God to all men, and in THIS country, they are protected from government by a Constitution.

Having said that, foreigners do have rights under the Bill of Rights, AND they are expected to obey the laws of the land as well---a citizen of Denmark traveling in the US on vacation WILL be arrested for possesion of marijuana because US laws apply while he's here. If US laws apply to him while he's here, so does due proccess. He will be deported, but a Judge has to say so, it isn't a case of the arresting officer driving him to the airport and telling him to leave.

One last thing, if the Bill of Rights does not apply to foreign nationals visiting the US, what stops me from grabbing a bunch of people traveling in from Japan on their way to a Disneyland vacation and making them my slaves?

196 posted on 12/02/2001 1:26:42 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
One last thing, if the Bill of Rights does not apply to foreign nationals visiting the US...

We, as citizens of a sovereign state, have graciously extended certain rights to our visitors. However, we have NOT extend the right of freedom of political speech (1st Amendment). Political speech regarding elections is strictly prohibited for non-citizens. That is why I say the that the Bill of Rights does not extend to non-citizens. Only those privileges that the government has chosen to extend have been granted.

That said, we have chosen to extend many, many privileges to immigrants and visitors because we are a nation of immigrants and we feel strongly about extending our hospitality. We have NOT extended freedom of political speech and the right to vote, however -- although to listen to some people, you'd think we have.

No other nation allows the freedoms to visitors that we have. Alians here can travel freely across this land without ever reporting their addresses or destinations. I cannot do that in any country that I have ever visited. Upon entry, I must give my destination and the address of every place I intend to stay. Upon exit, I must declare all my purchases.

To go to China, I had to declare every job I had ever held in my life and every address I'd had for some years prior. In China, I was required to use special "tourist money". If I'd been caught with Chinese money, I could have been prosecuted. Also, I was required to turn in my "tourist money" for refund upon my exit. It was illegal for me to take it from the country.

At the time I visited China, I also had to have all my arrangements (hotel, food, travel) prepaid. I could only spend money for gifts and souvenirs. I think that rule has changed. I am only citing these examples as examples of how other countries curtail visitors in ways we do not.

I am making this point so strongly because it was a revelation to me that this is the law when my Australian friends were nearly deported for engaging in election activities in a chintzy little local election. As I mentioned earlier on this thread, it required a 10 year battle, a lot of money, and intervention from one of the highest offices in the land to keep them in this country.

As a result, I never encourage foreign nationals to engage in political activity -- no posters in the windows of their businesses, no political contributions, nada. I would never want to be responsible for getting someone in trouble with the INS. But once they have citizenship, it's "Katie bar the door!" I'll hound them to register, to vote, and to contribute to my favorite candidates! LOL!

210 posted on 12/02/2001 2:06:19 PM PST by afraidfortherepublic
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To: Luis Gonzalez
You really must read post number 696.

I've had to argue the same point to so many people now, I've got it almost perfected.

To break the log jam in your mind, that prevents you from understanding me/reason, get this through your head: - the 4th Amendment right to not be searched without a warrant is not a divine right.

There.

That's a simple concept. Let's get that straight. 4th Amendment rights are not divinely endowed rights.

Most of the consternation I've seen on this 700+ thread is caused by people going who go around with the notion in their head that the Bill of Rights are like the 10 Commandments. There might be some overlap between those two documents, in places, but not enough to make Bob Barr right.

713 posted on 08/14/2002 8:41:56 PM PDT by H.Akston
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