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To: lexcorp; Aquinasfan
Yes, prayer can change things. it can give one the courage to do all manner of evil things, as well as good.

Which does not negate the fact that praying to the true God with the humility to do good according to His will help one in doing true good . . .

So prayer can help one to do good. Now, can prayer help one to do evil? One example is those who intentionally pray for the power to accomplish evil ends. This includes the demonic discussed earlier on the thread. What about those who are deluded into thinking they are doing God's will when they are not? If you are a self-appointed prophet, ala Jim Jones, you might want to consider the source . . . At least he was not a threat to world civilization -- certainly not any more . . .

The 9/11 terrorists present a problem that our free societies will have to address: Muslim fundamentalists who kill in the name of Allah in disregard of a good part of the Islamic tradition. A dangerous and politicized branch from (as opposed to "of"?) a traditionally recognized monotheistic religion. Who speaks authoritatively for Islam? Every self-appointed mosque leader, who collects funds for killer terrorists and recruits same? Dealing with this real threat, in an environment of freedom of religion and separation of state from sanctioned religion (a hallmark of our modern democracies which Islam itself does not recognize) will not prove a trivial exercise.

Not totally without precedent. In the VietNam era, there were many claiming conscientious objection. Didn't the Selective Service only grant CO status to those who were members of religions which had a tradition of pacifism? So the State had to look at the long-standing religious doctrines of e.g. the Quakers and others . . .

The same will have to be done to separate the "wheat" of authentic Islam from the "chaff" of those who advocate terrorism. Not a task we'd like the State to have to perform. There is no central authority for all of Islam. But we got into this mess from immigration policies based upon moral relativism and multi-culturalism, not from sensible tolerance of differences in religious viewpoints . . .

Speaking of which: moral relativism has led us to the point that the Armed Forces tolerate wiccan practice as a "religion". There was a manual published some years back giving chaplains advice about wiccan (witchcraft) practitioners . . . Freedom of religion, I'm sure the Founders intended, was the freedom to worship God without state interference, not the freedom to exercise an anti-religion. (Note: I am not speaking of agnosticism). However, here we are . . .

151 posted on 12/03/2001 12:42:39 PM PST by AMDG&BVMH
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To: AMDG&BVMH
I was trying to choose selections from your #151 to highlight, but I found myself highlighting the entire post. It would make a great thread in itself.

Maybe you could entitle it, "An acid test for 'the separation of Church and State' doctrine," or something more interesting. Great post.

155 posted on 12/03/2001 1:20:44 PM PST by Aquinasfan
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