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The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict
www.cactus48.com ^ | 2000 | Jews for Justice

Posted on 11/16/2001 1:16:15 PM PST by ExiledInTaiwan

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To: BikerNYC
Read Herodotus Book 3 Thalia. Mentions "Palestine" in 484-425 BC.. Long before the Romans leveled Jerusalem in 70 AD.
121 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:23 PM PST by Patria One
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To: BikerNYC
From Herodotus Book 3~ 484-425 BC

"[3.5] Now the only entrance into Egypt is by this desert: the country from Phoenicia to the borders of the city Cadytis belongs to the people called the Palaestine Syrians; from Cadytis, which it appears to me is a city almost as large as Sardis, the marts upon the coast till you reach Jenysus are the Arabian king's; after Jenysus the Syrians again come in, and extend to Lake Serbonis, near the place where Mount Casius juts out into the sea.

At Lake Serbonis, where the tale goes that Typhon hid himself, Egypt begins.

Now the whole tract between Jenysus on the one side, and Lake Serbonis and Mount Casius on the other, and this is no small space, being as much as three days' journey, is a dry desert without a drop of water."

122 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by Patria One
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To: Patria One
Funny, that Jews in America are doing just fine, but Israel has always been at war with her neighbors.

Hm, maybe that's because Israel is surrounded by Muslims whose holy book states that Jews and Christians must be conquered by Islam and made to pay the tax and "know themselves to be subdued" before they can be allowed to exist. And the Jews in America AREN'T surrounded by Muslims.

123 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by Anamensis
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To: ExiledInTaiwan
Just a little historical revision going on there, no problem, the same type attempts to rewrite the history of America, we don't listen to them either.
124 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: Patria One
What really happened was that the Zionist movement, from the beginning, looked forward to a practically complete dispossession of the indigenous Arab population so that Israel could be a wholly Jewish state, or as much as was possible. Land bought by the Jewish National Fund...

And that's the salient point. Land BOUGHT. Not stolen. Not given to. Not taken over. BOUGHT.

125 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by Anamensis
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To: Patria One
bump for later perusal
126 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by billbears
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To: Patria One
They should drill proper wells. Arafat has the money for driling these wells in his Swiss Bank accounts.
127 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:24 PM PST by dennisw
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To: Anamensis
Read about the Jewish Land Fund before you pop off.
128 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Patria One
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To: Elihu Burritt
Both sides have to be equally at fault or the cycle would end.

What a load of crap.

After every one of those ceremonies at the White House lawn or elsewhere- going back decades- where everyone promises "no more war", "no more violence" who, always, restarts the violence?

When was Oslo signed? How long after were buses getting blown up in Tel Aviv?

129 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: dennisw
ALL the wells are ILLEGAL under the Israeli occupation.
130 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Patria One
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To: MissAmericanPie
Historical revision?

Blame the Israelis.. They finally opened their archives.

131 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Patria One
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To: Patria One
Why don't you read it through, before you make a statement like that?

Have you read Mein Kampf? Das Kapital? The Wealth of Nations?
Silly questions...

132 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Publius6961
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To: cake_crumb
"How about the rants from the...crowd who think that...peace between these people is now possible, "

As I just said to veronica, I don't think much of fanatics from either side of the conflict.
The "our way is the only way as per G*d" attitude keeps the conflict going.

"but the things listed above may be unachievable due to biased reporting of the facts from both sides,
thereby never giving such possible peace a chance to exist?"

True enough.
That's why I try to read ALL the available info.
Unlike a lot of people who scream "leftist trash", "anti-semitic",
and "Jewish lies" if the info reported doesn't fit their world-view.
If a few more people did so, maybe we could get some discussion that gets a bit further than:
"I'm RIGHT and you're a ______ since you don't agree with me!"
which is what most of these threads consist of.
Unfortunatly, most posters on these threads appear to have no desire for dialog, just screaming.
It's a good example of whats happening over there,
just without the rocks, guns, and bombs.
133 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by freefly
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To: Publius6961
Haven't read ANY of the above. Not so much interested in racist "ISMS" as history.
134 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:25 PM PST by Patria One
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To: equus
An awful lot of over-reaction here. How about a rational discussion of the book's contents--or is that too scary for you?

Let's make a deal.
We'll read Muslim hate propaganda, and you read white-supremacist hate propaganda.

Then we'll compare notes.
Too scary for you?

135 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:26 PM PST by Publius6961
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To: equus

The wells are running dry in West Bank villages (23/5/01)


By Zafrir Rinat

Water tables in the aquifers supplying West Bank villages have fallen sharply, implying that water shortages in these villages will worsen during the summer. Security problems make it difficult to find hydrological or engineering solutions for the problem, say Israeli sources engaged in water issues with the Palestinians.

Palestinians draw water from wells in areas controlled by the PA (Palestinian Authority), from springs providing tens of millions of cubic meters of water, and from the Israeli water system. In recent months there has been a significant drop in the quantity of water from wells and springs.

Data collected by the Israeli technical team of the joint Israeli-Palestinian water committee indicates that a significant number of the springs in the West Bank have dried up completely or are providing very little water. A serious example is the springs that used to supply a large proportion of the water to Nablus and Ein Uja, and a large spring that supplied water to Jericho, which has dried up completely.

The level of water Herodion region wells dropped so drastically that new equipment has been ordered to deepen the wells, and pumping has been scaled back. These wells supply most of the towns and villages in the southern West Bank.

There has also been a sharp drop in the water table of the well that supplies the city of Ramallah. That well is the responsibility of the PA.

Yossi Dreizin, of the Israeli Water Commission, who heads the Israeli technical committee to the joint water committee, says it will be difficult to supply water to Ramallah in the summer, and the Palestinians will become more dependent on the Israeli water system.

There are also serious water supply problems in the northern West Bank. The water table of the wells there has dropped and private wells drilled around Jenin and in the Tirtza River region, east of Nablus, have caused the water source in the area to dry up. One well south of Jenin is also almost completely dry.

The water shortage has been caused not only by insufficient rain over the past three years, but also by increased Palestinian water use because of population growth and drilling of private wells that waste a lot of water. Another major reason is the growth of populations in the Jewish settlements that are supplied with water according to consumption levels in the rest of Israel. Pipelines that feed the settlements also supply the Palestinians.

Even before the Al-Aqsa Intifada there was a water shortage in Arab villages, especially in the summer. This has worsened because of the minimum rainfall this past winter and because Israeli technicians cannot maintain wells and distribution facilities because of the fighting.

Israeli teams from Mekorot water company have been unable to address the technical problems of the wells drilled near Beit Sahur because of shooting in the area. They also have been unable to carry out important regular maintenance work on the wells near Jenin. The PA also has water technicians, but they too have had problems getting to the wells.

Another problem that causes the loss of large quantities of water is the theft of water from the main pipelines, such as the line that leads from Herodion to Hebron and the line near Itamar in the Shomron. An Israeli source said Palestinians come to the pipelines during the night and drill holes to attach sub-pipelines that siphon off water for agricultural irrigation.

Israel does not have complete information on water sources in the PA areas because the inspection teams that operated on behalf of the technical committee - and also dealt with preventing pirated drillings - have not been operating since the beginning of the Intifada.

Even so, the Palestinian Water Commission has continued to provide Israel with data. Israeli water experts fear a situation in which the long-term lack of protection for water sources controlled by the PA will make it impossible to estimate the effect of pumping on the ground water that Israel uses also.

The Israeli team to the Israeli-Palestinian water talks is now headed by Shimon Tal, who took over from Noah Kinarty. The latter had been close with former prime minister Ehud Barak, and had left his position when Prime Minister Arik Sharon was elected.

The Palestinians have already asked Israel to increase their water allocation and the technical committee was supposed to discuss the matter this past Sunday. While the Israeli members of the committee were on their way to the meeting with their Palestinian counterparts, however, the Israelis were informed that it had been canceled because of security problems.

One solution offered by Israel is for Palestinian water tanker trucks to come to junctions in the water pipeline system and take water from there.

Dreizin says, however, that this as a complicated logistic operation that has not yet been put into practice.

Dreizin notes that Israel is willing to examine other options for cooperation with the Palestinian in order to solve the water supply problems.

In the meantime, Israel has demanded that the PA prevent the theft of water and halt the phenomenon of pirated drillings, though Israel has given permission to the PA to drill wells in the Bnei Na'im region near Hebron. These drillings will be dependent on the Palestinians and the Americans, who are financing the PA's water projects. These wells will at least alleviate the water crisis in the Hebron area.


136 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:26 PM PST by dennisw
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To: Sabramerican
I havn't been "turned", but you people sure work hard at it.

"Maybe the rant you hear is the death agony of toddlers getting blown up."

Yea, the death agony of toddlers from both sides.
Too bad you only give a flip about the ones with the "correct" citizenship.
137 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:26 PM PST by freefly
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To: Patria One
Jews in America are doing just fine, but Israel has always been at war with her neighbors.

You have it exactly backwards.
If Canada and Mexico were Muslim, America would have been at war a long time too...

138 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:26 PM PST by Publius6961
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To: Patria One
So, what are you saying? One ancient text is more reliable than the other? Does it matter? Each side views its divine mandate as absolute.
139 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:27 PM PST by BikerNYC
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To: Patria One
And where would you like me to read about it, oh wise and saintly one? Do you have a nice, tight, summary somewhere I can read or is this one of those "drop out of school and spend the next three months reading this 700 page tome which of course you won't do so I'll continue to act as though you can't possibly know what I'm talking about therefore I need not address you" propositions?
140 posted on 11/16/2001 1:18:27 PM PST by Anamensis
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