H.R.3162 PATRIOT ACT{ YOUR NEW- POLICESTATE- LOOK FOR YOUR SELF}

thomas ^ | GOVERNMENT

[freedomnews]

H.R.3162

Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism (USA PATRIOT ACT) Act of 2001

[Native American Female Vet]

I understand that, but I am sick and tired of taking the flames and rude comments from him and others like him. They run around this forum and attack people with the snide, snippy and rude one liners they have used so well that make others leave this forum. Well this is my Free Republic too and if this is the first place I have to make my stand then so be it. I need the practice anyway.

[LiberteeBell]

You go girl! I'm with you all the way. See my post #139. I too am tired of all the flaming and personal attacks, meanwhile refusing to discuss the issues.

[Liberty Teeth]

Its up to you. Then again you'll probably just hand it off to gubmint like a coward.

[muawiyah]

Louis XIV was real, and he was big-time news in the 18th Century when the Founding Fathers lived.

The Founders were also well versed in Huguenot, not just English, history. The Constitution has many sources.

Now, what sort of mysticism is this? Your use of the term in the sense of our discussion suggests to me that when you get to the First Amendment and you see the word "religion" you turn to your mate (friend, the neighbor, whoever) and say "see there, I told you the people who wrote the Constitution were a bunch of whacked out flying saucer cult people".

Or is there some other sense in which I am to read what you said?

[Liberty Teeth]

"Why, because we no longer needed them."

Was the income tax set up for the war effort?

[northislander]

I AGREE!

It never WAS...it is NOT...nor should it ever BE - a legitimate function of a limited Federal Government to PROTECT a free people!

[Jolly Rodgers]

Or is there some other sense in which I am to read what you said?

You are as far off base in interpreting the motivation for my comments as you are in interpreting the intent of the founding fathers. I'll not deny that religious freedom was one of the factors which influenced them, but it was only one of many. Trying to interpret it as the only factor is folly and leads to absurdities such as you've written on this thread.

[roughrider]

The solution to the terrorist problem was simple. Declare war on all of the organizations, or simply declare them enemies of the United States. This puts them under the jurisdiction of the military. As Louis Freeh revealed to Congress in 1999, the FBI knows where most of the terrorist cells are. The military can go out and round them up, as they will be prisoners of war. As they wear no uniforms, they are subject to trials by courts martial, as they are saboteurs and spies under rules of war. They can be interrogated as POWs, and then executed by firing squads. End of domestic terrorist cell problem, without passing a bill that can later be used to suppress legitimate political activity of actual American citizens. Now, why won't the government do this? Why pass yet another paper law? What is a paper law going to do to protect us? The "Anti-Terrorist" law passed after the Murrah Building bombing did not stop terrorist acts, but some better CONSTITUTIONAL enforcement and protective actions by the US government COULD have stopped the 9/11 attacks. Why weren't such measures taken, and what makes us think yet ANOTHER paper law will improve the performance of the government in protecting us from terrorists? Muhammed Atta was in the custody, or under investigation by, FOUR DIFFERENT FEDERAL AGENCIES up to 9/11, and all let him walk, including INS, who questioned him about his "Tourist" visa when Atta openly admitted to INS agents at the airport that, as a "tourist," he planned to learn how to fly airliners.

[Garrisson Lee]

We voted. We voted for a republican small government to roll back the abuses of Clinton, and we apparrently got Al Gore.

[Native American Female Vet]

"but the ones I am concerned about the most will sunset Dec. 31st, 2005. "

Did you see that little detail that says any investigation started is not subject to the sunset? Didnt think so. That means if the day before the sunset takes effect and someone decides anyone they choose 'may' need investigating they can take as long as they like. So 05 is not a sunset. 2005 is a long way off and the definition of 'terrorist' is all in who is defining it.

[Garrisson Lee]

You've handled yourself quite well in this discussion. Thank you.

[Native American Female Vet]

Way to go Jolly

Eagles Up as we use to say here

[Garrisson Lee]

Yes, Eagles up. This used to be a forum dedicated to seeking the truth and defending the Constitution. It's getting more like Luciane.com every day.

[Mercuria]

Only the reactionary absolutists and anarchists find this bill troubling, because they are anti-government.

Anti-[big] government [control], pro-freedom...like the MAJORITY of the members of this board...last year, anyway...

[Native American Female Vet]

I will look for it later Jolly but the sunset is NOT for investigation that are started.

[Mercuria]

...and I don't appreciate your implying that unless we swallow everything the government does, hook, line and sinker, we are traitors.

Hear, hear!!!

[Mercuria]

PS. Get your @ss back to democraticunderground with the rest of the filth.

Maybe you're the one who should take your tushie over there.

They're for massive government oversight of the peon citizens, too, so you should feel right at home.

[LiberteeBell]

Anti-[big] government [control], pro-freedom...like the MAJORITY of the members of this board...last year, anyway...

Hear, hear! to you too!

[Mercuria]

If you don't have anything to hide you wont be effected by this bill.

Got news for you:

I have the right to hide ABSOLUTELY NOTHING from the government if the only due process it can come up with against me is "we're at war".

Unless you believe the American citizenry as a whole should be considered guilty until proven innocent?

[Garrisson Lee]

If privacy wasn't of value, we wouldn't have doors on bathrooms. After all, we all know or can guess, what's going on in there, but don't we deserve to be left alone?

What's with these people?