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To: mercy; Guenevere; illstillbe
They should be considered a nation. Their terrorism is just assemetrical warfare and this effort of ours MUST be a war on their nation.

Of course your point here is that Islam should be considered a nation. If and when you are in the position of separating and codifying the nations perhaps your opinion will carry some weight. At the present it is simply your opinion and you have every right to express it. However, we would not be justified in forming national policy based upon your individual opinion.

What you are suggesting is that the US declare war on the nation of Islam when in fact there is no such nation. If you listened to President Bush and others in the current administration they very definitively addressed the fact that the enemy is very ill-defined. At this particular point in history the enemy has been defined as Bin Laden's organization which is spread around the world in more than 36 nations according to my best recollection.

I am not naive enough to believe that there are not many who follow the prophet (sp??) who agree with the thoughts and ideals as put forth by Bin Laden and his ilk. On the other hand there are very many who condemn his actions vociferously.

Who as individuals or what groups of Moslem believers would you include in your war against this fictitious nation? My personal belief is that the founder of this religion was a false prophet. I base my beliefs on what I consider to be the Word of the Living God, the Bible. I cannot find any passage in the Bible that commands, urges, infers or suggests that I go to war with unbelievers. Rather, I am told to let the Light of Christ so shine in my life that men will see my good works and glorify my Father who is in Heaven.

I shall not go to war with all Islam. When I am attacked because of my belief in the Lord Jesus Christ I am told to turn my other cheek and allow my attacker to hit me there also for they are then doing as the Lord told the apostle Paul "you are kicking against the goads".

On the other hand, when and if Islam attacks the US for reasons other than Christianity I shall gladly and willingly ferociously fight for the principles of freedom. I have done it before and herewith publicly proclaim to do so again.

In my opinion, the US has not yet been attacked because of the many Christians in this nation. There are far more unbelievers in the country than believers. It is my belief that the United States has been attacked because of the freedom and luxurious life style it portrays. I don't believe in living luxuriously but I'll defend to death the right of one who can do so legitimately.

Having said all that, it is my opinion that there are many actions we should take, individually and as a nation, to prevent to as great an extent as possible, further deterioration of the lawlessness rampant in the US today.

94 posted on 10/20/2001 3:01:31 PM PDT by oldngray
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To: oldngray
Nope. My posts made my position pretty clear. I have talked about the emerging nation of united Islamists. This is one of the names the people we call islamic religious extremists, or terrorists call themselves.

On page XXXiii of Yossef Bodansky's book on OBL and terror orgs in general, between the intro and the main body of the book, he lists fifteen well established and funded islamist terrorist organizations.

He also does an admirable job of detailing how strong and how long standing this network is and where it plans to go. He also make it clear that the nation of Iran is the premier state sponsor of terrorism and practices it as state policy at the highest level.

Iran is the main distributor of Saudi Arabian cash to all the orgs. OBL is obedient to his Iranian masters in the main although I think he is now a prince of terror in his own right. Maybe a king. Bodansky also makes it clear that Sudan practices terrorism as state policy.

I'm not really advocating a religious war. I am advocating that we have been attacked by the equivalent of an Islamist nation in a religious cause. Their religious cause. This nation I speak of is not now united in geology. But it soon will be.

98 posted on 10/20/2001 3:24:29 PM PDT by mercy
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To: oldngray
Your posts are so thought provoking and measured it takes me a while to respond and so I do so in more than one reply post.

****At this particular point in history the enemy has been defined as Bin Laden's organization which is spread around the world in more than 36 nations according to my best recollection.****

Yes, this is our focal point, however I am convinced that this is just the single step beginning a long journey and that this is also President Bush's belief. OBL is no more than a convienent focus point for the moment. I don't even think we will get him any time soon.

Any nation that aids or abetts terrorism against the US shall be considered a terrorist nation. That's the Bush doctrine. He better stick with it because it is the only way to succeed. Our present actions can only increase the number and severity of the terrorist attacks. Yet what we now do is all that we CAN do untill we can get massive military troop buildups and machinery into place.

Heretofore unknown levels of violence on a scale unimmaginable to all but the most experienced military mind ... must be unleashed on what you call my 'immaginary islamist state'. Where to drop the bombs? Where to invade? Believe me our government operatives know where. Exactly where. I just don't think we as a nation can muster the will and the courage.

Only horrific FORCE will deter these people from their jihad. They are on a holy crusade. If we do not stop them ASAP it will not be just a few 'dirty nukes' or some truck bombs. It will be aerosol burst bio-loaded missiles over European cities and constant terror attacks of every description here in the US.

100 posted on 10/20/2001 3:45:07 PM PDT by mercy
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