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To: RobbyS
And how did you come to the conclusion that you--and you alone--are competent to make judgements of this sort, knowing, as I suppose you know, about the tumult, the bloodshed caused by the decision of the Reformers simply to ignore 1500 years of Church history and to reconstruct Christian doctrine on the basis of the Scripture alone. They ar least did not have hindsight to show them the consequences of their speculations.

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"...the bloodshed caused by the decision of the Reformers simply to ignore 1500 years of Church history and to reconstruct Christian doctrine on the basis of the Scripture alone."

Very interesting. I suppose there was no bloodshed, no executions, deaths, murders, of "heretics" in the first 1,500 years? The sole reason for the Reformation was based on "Scripture Alone"? No bloodshed was caused as a result of the "Counter Reformation"?

And just where did you learn your history?
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916 posted on 10/18/2001 6:42:52 AM PDT by OLD REGGIE
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To: Havoc
They have rituals because they don't know the authority of the Lord. If you can't do what you've set out to do, you might as well make it look good. I know the authority of the Lord and I have it working in my life. Waving crosses, lighting candles and burning incense doesn't bother the Devil. Nor do pious Latin incantations - witches and satanists do the same things to draw demons, not to get rid of them. But even they are forced to recognize the authority of a Jesus in a Christian with faith in the Lord who knows the scripture and functions in obedience to God.

Then how come every scary movie with vampires or demons possessing someone (like the movie I watched last night) has people in trouble with the devil and they always want a priest? Huh?

I've seen a lot of such movies and never, never has one person ever shouted out "get me a good Bible-based non-denominationl preacher." No, it's always priests and Holy Water and Crosses. :-)

Seriously though, possession is real and so is exorcism. And it is, of course, the power and faith in Christ of the exorcist that does the job. But the holy items help. They are battle tested. The movie "The Exorcist" was based on the story of a little boy in Maryland. His parents took him to see his pastor, a Lutheran. The pastor told the family "better go to the Catholics, they know how to deal with this."

SD

918 posted on 10/18/2001 6:55:20 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: OLD REGGIE
My, you guys have marched on. Well, my history tells me that Heretics are seldom the innocent lambs as portrayed. For instance, the Donatists in North Africa had the same "attitude" as bin Laden, and it is impossible to understand the development of St. Augustine's theology without understanding his frustration with this sect. In the beginning he tried reason and in return saw his priests murdered and his churches burned. Finally, grudgingly and in defence of his flock, to turned to the government for protection. If Augustine 's moved toward Predestination was prompted by his experience, which showed him that the Devil was loose in the world and had many followers.

The Albi, over whom liberals and Protestants shed so many tears were equally intractable. By the time of Monfort's Crusade, they controlled 1000 towns in France and if their "Perfects" were noncombatants, the many nobles who supported them certainly were not. How would you react if the Muslims took over the State of Mississippi and began closing the Federal Courts? Such people are not harmless. To be sure, Religious war almost inevitable leads to slaughter, including ther slaughter of the harmless and helpless, and to the pernicious doctrine of the Inquisition that it is right to kill the body in order to save the soul. On the other hand, as the movie "Dead Man Walking" shows, it is sometimes the case that a man who faces execution will find the need to re-examine the state of his soul and repent. Even McVeigh may have reached that point.

1,065 posted on 10/18/2001 1:46:48 PM PDT by RobbyS
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