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To: PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain; hopefulpilgrim; Iowegian; RobbyS; IMRight; Steven; OLD REGGIE...
Hi all.I've not tried to write this down before so this will be a bit of a rant.

I believe it is vital for a christian to know from the start of their walk with God that they are saved.I believe that not knowing has a smothering effect on a persons growth as a christian and limits the Spirit's influence in their life.

I believe that since God created man then it is He that understands best how man ticks.I also believe that we have much in us that is hard-wired by God and that certain stimuli have certain effects that are as certain as the law of gravity,that there are spiritual laws that can't be broken without consequence.

Let me give an illustration...

A man comes to work in the morning,he's whistling,saying hello and good morning to any and everyone,commenting on what a great day it is,even though he's soaked through from helping a bunch of teenagers gather up their scattered baseball cards from all over the sidewalk and he walks into the office ranting about how great it is to be alive! Some folks smile and wonder what he's been smoking,some folks are annoyed that someone else is so happy when their lives are miserable (although even they grudgingly admit that he sure is infectious!)and some folks know he's about to go on holidays to the Bahamas.Which pretty much explains the attitude he has.

I'm sure you can all identify with what I'm saying even if I did stretch it just a tad.

The point I am trying to make is that this person had a wonderfull promise that was on the verge of being realized and it effected his attitude in a major way....and it's a safe bet he wasn't even trying to be nice...it was simply coming out of him as a result of his hope....in fact the only thing that would stifle his joy would be if he WASN'T SURE it was true...or he simply didn't really believe it!

Think about this....was it the man doing the good works or the promise inside him?...."For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief."(Hebrews 4:10-11) So much of what I see in christendom seems to say that we should try and act nice,try and be cheerfull,try to have a happy outlook etc etc when the bible actually says ".....for the joy of the LORD is your strength"(Nehemiah 8:10)

I can't see how anyone could argue this.It seems as true as the sky is blue...put a sure promise inside someone and stand back! Once the person comprehends what is going to happen there will be no stopping them...they will be 'up' no matter what the present circumstances might be...and they won't have to try!

God is trying to fill us with a sure hope....

"Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace;*TO THE END THE PROMISE MIGHT BE SURE to all the seed..."

God is very keen for us to know this...

"Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil"(Hebrews 6:17-19)

The church needs to get this....if they are not understanding this then what are they teaching? I've been a christian for long enough now to have seen people go to church,do all the right things,attend hundreds of conferences,meetings,give to the poor,always at prayer groups and bible studies and even become ministers and then after 20 or so yrs have a complete breakdown of themselves and their ministries...and then wonder why God didn't help them! Like I said in a previous post....people come out of cults and are de-programmed....the world is the worst cult of all and yet there is no de-programming! People come and sit in church with the same old carnal way of seeing and thinking and then set about (and are encouraged to set about) doing the "work of God" according to that old worldly understanding....the church seems intent on manufacturing Martha's.

Jesus was VERY specific about what the work of God was in John 6:29....the acting nice and being peacefull and giving to the poor and needy,praying for them etc etc was to be God's work in and through us NOT OURS! Our "job" was to believe....that's what we are supposed to be doing and the rest will be a result of that.

Jesus didn't say "come to me all you who are weary and heavy laden and I will give you work to do"...He said He would give us REST...let us labour therefore to ENTER that rest (Hebrews 4)...work out your salvation with fear and trembling...give dilligence therefore to make SURE your election and calling,for IF you do this you will NEVER FALL.(2nd Peter 1)

Humans seem to subconciously gravitate towards that which is behind the veil....hence the gazillions of religions,apparitions,spooky stories,rituals etc etc etc.However the bible tells us exactly how we are to do it according to the truth...."which HOPE we HAVE as an anchor for the soul AND which entereth into that which is within the veil"...the sure hope takes us behind the veil.

It does something else as well...

"Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature..."(2nd Peter 1:4)

exceeding great and precious promises:THAT BY THESE ye might be partakers of the divine nature!

Thus...we enter into that which is behind the veil BY the sure promise of God and we become a partaker of the divine nature BY the promise of God also....if that promise is never sure....then you will not be entering into the veil OR partaking of the divine nature....you may spend your entire christian walk "busting a gut" but the JOY of God will not be your strength....it will be your works and not God's....and ultimately they will fail.

Listen to Jesus words for those who may think and teach differently....

Luke 11:52"Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered."

The key of knowledge is the GRACE of God....and His perfect love will cast out ALL fear.

I believe that this is what 1st John 5:13 is talking about....If you believe on Jesus then you can KNOW ye have eternal life...and by knowing that you can now go on to "believe all things" "enter into that which is within the veil" "come boldly to the throne of grace" "be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God."

Told you it would be a rant...hope it blesses you.

grace and peace to you all

God bless

1,600 posted on 10/20/2001 5:57:35 PM PDT by mitch5501
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To: mitch5501
The point I am trying to make is that this person had a wonderfull promise that was on the verge of being realized and it effected his attitude in a major way

Very nicely put!

1,605 posted on 10/20/2001 6:26:06 PM PDT by IMRight
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To: mitch5501
Mitch, I haven't finished reading your "rant." I wanted to stop where I was, which was right here:

and it's a safe bet he wasn't even trying to be nice...it was simply coming out of him as a result of his hope....in fact the only thing that would stifle his joy would be if he WASN'T SURE it was true...or he simply didn't really believe it!.......

and say that I was really "into" your illustration, vicariously experiencing the same emotion as the man, all happy and full of anticipation....until you said that his joy would be stifled if he was not sure if he'd be able to go or not. At that point, I know this may sound ridiculous to some, my stomach felt like it had a butterfly...you know, nervous and like there is a dark cloud over my head. Weird. I think I know where you're headed with this!!!

1,625 posted on 10/20/2001 9:13:39 PM PDT by hopefulpilgrim
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To: mitch5501
Told you it would be a rant...hope it blesses you.

Hey, you can rant any time you want. It blessed me, brother. (Do you know that hymn, "Jesus, I am Resting" ?) Praise to our gracious and holy God!!

1,626 posted on 10/20/2001 9:25:37 PM PDT by hopefulpilgrim
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To: mitch5501
Rant away:)

Becky

1,662 posted on 10/21/2001 12:26:46 PM PDT by PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain
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