Posted on 10/15/2001 6:54:40 AM PDT by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.
19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.
Does the bold help any?
Do you wonder why the don't?
Purgatory pulls the teeth of the bumble in the eyes of the unknowing - they can't see the bumble just put blackout on his teeth after sharpening them...
Becky
Maybe in your neck of the woods. Here some of the Churches have beer at their summer festivals.
(I won't mention the priest who once commented "Beer - the Eighth Sacrament")
You are right that drunkeness, especially habitual, is sinful. And you mention gluttony. But you don't abstain from eating at all, because some people eat too much, do you?
All things in moderation. A time to mourn, a time for joy.
For example: We have done a bible study with the guy who shoes my horses, he is a "real" cowboy, he say he knows what we have taught him is right and that he should accept it and start living right, but he is not ready to quit drinking beer. See, to him if you drink beer you are not a Christian.
I would disabuse him of this notion and welcome him home. By holding up this standard of "real Christians don't drink" you have set up a wall to keep him out. I think JHavard would wail about not showing him mercy, and setting up impossible burdens for this man. Save him now and let him get a handle on his drinking later. (I'm sure that is what you are trying to do.)
SD
This has to win Sentence of the Month. I defy anyone here to tell me what this means.
I believe he is saying that like in Rundolf the red-nosed reinder pulling the teeth of the bumble, purgatory just makes sin appear less harmful but does not change the nature of sin
I believe in Mr. Havocs version of Rudolph, the bumble at the elves and Santa after putting the star on top of the tree
Nobody has an excuse for not knowing Christ.
"[18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; [19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. [20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: [21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. [22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, [23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things." - Ro 1:18-23
-ksen
Becky
No.
Oh. OK. You will be changed from a weak human with sinful impulses to a perfect creature but you don't think you'll be aware of this happening. OK
In any event, I think we have agreed that sometime after we die (unless we are "Raptured") we will be changed into something perfect, through the power of Christ's sacrifice. We will be transformed into a being worthy of standing in God's Presence.
*Why do I feel that I am walking into a trap?*
Because, leaving aside the baggage of helping each other out and indulgences, etc, we have agreed that there is a Purification process that occurs after death. This is the state of existence we Catholics call Purgatory.
SD
I figured you did. It sounds like he's looking for an excuse.
SD
It makes about as much sense as trying to prove purgatory or a fiery hell exists. All tortured logic.
American people in general do not look back and consequently we too often plan for tomorrow based on misconceptions of the past. I think it could be fun to look at the whole issue and discuss it at length at some point but for now I want to throw out two statements for your consideration.
1.American society and prosperity therein is/was driven by the White,Anglo-Saxon,Protestant work ethic.
2.Demographic studies, well into the 60's,placed Catholics in the "upper-lower" class and "lower-middle"class, socio-economically.
I think these two statements have much to do with our value system, religion in American life,the "Culture of Death"and September 11. Any thoughts?
Becky
If they are illusions that does not add a point to existing. Only if they are real is existance meaningful
No insult meant to either of you, but are you by any chance related to Dfendr.
Becky
Becky
What is the name of the book we always refer you folks to (besides the CE)? The full title is "The Catechism of the Catholic Church" If they were to need to use "Roman" as their official title it would be used there, I would think.
When people do use "Roman" it is to avoid cofusion with other churches, or to avoid offense. I don't know where trad_anglican is , but he would take offense in my saying we were "just plain Catholic." He thinks his Church is Catholic as well and that we need to add "Roman" to our name to distinguish the "Anglican Catholic" from the Roman Catholic." We may use "Roman" in certain situations for clarity, but officially it is not our name.
Others like to think of the Catholic Church named in the creeds as the "invisible" Church of all believers. They also take offense at an unmodified "Catholic" being used by us.
Inside of the (Roman) Catholic Church, the term Roman often refers only to the major western rite, or Roman Rite. There are other Catholics who are not Roman at all, other than in allegiance to the Pope. Byzantine Catholics and the other eastern Churches are not "Roman." I am a "Roman Catholic" in the sense that I am a "Roman" or "Latin Rite" type of Catholic.
SD
Ya'll never watched rudolph as kids? I give you allusion from something popular and known and everyone scratches their heads.. Here's a hint, Death. Sin is death in the spirit for those who die in sin. Purgatory is an illusion that pulls the teeth out of that bumble and makes people think they can make it if only their sins aren't that big... Sin is death. The Bumble's teeth arent pulled, the RCC just put blackout on the teeth and use flowery words to say 'look, it can't touch you.' Unfortuneately for those who don't know scripture, they'll not realize the deception till the Bumble bites and the Word of God judges them and sends them to hell.
Ya'll never watched rudolph as kids? I give you allusion from something popular and known and everyone scratches their heads.. Here's a hint, Death. Sin is death in the spirit for those who die in sin. Purgatory is an illusion that pulls the teeth out of that bumble and makes people think they can make it if only their sins aren't that big... Sin is death. The Bumble's teeth arent pulled, the RCC just put blackout on the teeth and use flowery words to say 'look, it can't touch you.' Unfortuneately for those who don't know scripture, they'll not realize the deception till the Bumble bites and the Word of God judges them and sends them to hell.
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