Posted on 10/15/2001 6:54:40 AM PDT by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
What I do know is that the RCC has not been very effective in spotting and throwing out those without a proper calling to serve God.
On the contrary, the agitators in charge of many of the seminaries have been too busy blocking candidates for being too "rigid" in their orthodoxy. Being homosexual isn't a problem to them. Thinking homosexuality is a "disorder" and that women can never be "priests" is a huge problem.
If the blessings to come from the entire Law scandal amount to anything, a thorough clearing out of the dried up "Spirit of Vatican II" loonies in charge of the seminaries would be a good place to start.
SD
LOL. It's good to be back.
SD
I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are.
For as we have many members in one body, but all the members do not have the same function, so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and individually members of one another.
Oh, you again. Thought you'd run off again. Problems don't arise from misinterpretation - they arise from the pride that accompanies one's surity in their own understanding though they be wrong. Pride goeth before the fall.
We need a guy like Ratzinger (spelling is probably wrong) to straighten out the whole American Catholic Church if you ask me.
Be careful what you ask for. How about if he is the next Pope? He'd be great for those who want the RCC to go backwards about 500 years.
Afraid of the boogie man, are we? Ratzinger would make an excellent Pope, but he will never be. So don't worry too much about the Inquisition returning. Ratzinger would, at best, return the Church to about 1970 and start over from there. Restoring a balance to the excesses perpetuated in the name of "the spirit of Vatican II."
An example. The documents of Vatican II state that preserving our commonality and our treasure of Latin was something to be desired, even if more of the Mass was made in the vernacular.
Instead, the vandals threw out the Latin altogether. It is only now that many my age are discovering what was stolen from us, our heritage. Vatican II never mandated this. "The Spirit of Vatican II" was a convenient excuse for the progressive vandals to attempt to destroy from within the Church. A Ratzinger sees them for what they are and would lead us back to the proper vision of the poet-conciliar Church.
SD
Are you sure about that? :-)
SD
Well it's that or the fact that the church just would not subject itself to civil authority.. Just as bad.
But even the Anglicans(at least some of them) have stated that any unity in Christianity would have to be "under" the pope of Rome.
But even the Catholics (at least some of them) have stated that every Pope since Pius XII is the Anti-Christ.
One of your most brilliant statements.
Thank you. I aim to please.
For your information, I qualified my remark because I had just had a conversation with trad_anglican about how the Anglican communion isn't really "one" in any sense that the individual churches would be bound to stand behind a statement by one bishop or one subset of bishops. And secondly that TA's Church wouldn't necessarily follow any official proclamation of the ArchBishop of Canterbury anyway, since they "parted company" in the last century.
So I attempted to qualify my statement in a manner as to not offend. I am sorry you find in this only a scab to pick at. It must be difficult trying to find things to argue about that I say, so I will grant you this quibbling.
SD
Yep, any church that allows homosexuals to be priests or pastors, whether RC or NC, is by defintion corrupt and is wasting away from the inside, like a cancer inside the body.
Are you distinguishing between active practicing homosexuals and people who find themselves inclined to be tempted that way, but resist?
SD
Right up to the point where it's an institutional problem, then the institution is liable as well. Let's just put a face on this that everyone can plainly understand. If it were'nt for the laws forged into RCC canon and into the legal systems of Europe as a result, the majority of these priests would be rotting in Jail rather than "letting the church handle it." And that's a fact.
Speak of the devil, I was just getting to you.
Now then, what on earth are you talking about? What laws in Europe are there that say that priests are above the law, or whatever ridiculous claim you are making? Keep in mind we don't all share your biases or peculiar vision, so you'll have to provide us with some rational facts.
Are you also aware that Boston is not in Europe?
SD
Ya right. Now the "C" in catholic was capitolized in 110ad. The propaganda is officially out of control.
I don't know why you think this is an argument. Regarless of when the word got officially capitalized, the word was still referring to the same institution, the same Church.
When Microsoft was just Bill Gates and pals in his garage, before they got the officially registered trademark and logo, they were still the same group. N'est-ce pas?
SD
Yep. Interpretations can be corrected if God so chooses to let people see their error. Pride is something that must be worked on.
For the record, at the time we expressed our fervent desire and belief that we continue in communion with Canterbury. They have never recognized us as part of the "Anglican Communion" (they actually keep a list in some desk at Lambeth House of who is "officially" in and who is not). The most recent Lambeth conference (decannual meeting of all bishops of the communion) passed a resolution to explore ways of improving relations with the "continuing" Anglican churches, so at least they know we're here.
Just curious. This quote was pre-Roman/Orthodox split. So which catholic "big C" church was St. Ignatius of Antioch reffering to?
Would you believe that the Catholic Church still considers herself to be "orthodox" and the Orthodox Church still considers herself to be "catholic?"
The names are a convention, how we deal with the split. If you ask our Orthodox friends here, deep in their hearts, they'll tell you that they are the real "Catholic" Church.
SD
Are you sure the list isn't in the "basement" somewhere? It makes it sound more sinister. ;-)
Thanks for the clarification. What was the big reason for the split?
SD
Thank you for your response. I had always pictured the Orthodox churches as being made up entirely of people wearing monk’s robes, swinging those things with the incense in them, and singing in Gregorian chant. Reading the posts of you, Wordsmith and newberger have given me a more realistic view of your church.
Censer. I know Wordsmith already told you that, but I wanted to verify that we Romans call that a "censer" as well. If you learn nothing else here on the Neverending Thread, as least remember this. It might come up on Jeopardy sometime. ;-)
SD
Or so you claim, yet again without proof.
Ya but they don't recognize your infallible pope.
I thought you were told that by someone, SD maybe?, that the Catechism wasn't necessarily official Catholic teaching
Dave never would have said that or any other RC. The Catechism is the official teaching of the RC Church. You might be thinking about the Catholic Encyclopedia which gets quoted a lot here, too, yet is unofficial.
Thanks. You are correct, though angelo is also correct in making the point that the Latin meaning is official over any vernacular translation. This is, of course, not to say that the vernacular books are without worth, or perhaps translated by retarded monkeys. On the contrary, the point is true for nearly all things in life. Translations are not official.
If you sign a contract it tells you which state's laws are governing the enforcement and understanding of itself. If you do business with a foreign country, say Japan, you may get translations of contracts and whatnot. But believe me, if something is in doubt, the translation goes out the window.
All this means that when someone likes to make a creative meaning out of a particular English phrase, he can be reminded that that is not what the original means. This comes up about once in a blue moon, but the idea of having documents "official" in not only a foreign language, but a dead language, is fodder for the conspiracy folks.
SD
Priestesses in the US and Canada, mainly. Subsequently in other countries. There were many things going on but the priestess issue, by invalidating Holy Orders and therefore the other sacraments as well, was the issue that gave us no choice but to break our ecclesiastical ties and seek orthodox (little o) episcopal oversight.
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