The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles) -- Thread 161

Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

[malakhi]

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.

Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams

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The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles) -- Thread 160

[the808bass]

As Tag Team would say, "One more 'gain"

Thanx for the thread

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Saying there are questions believers should not ask is admitting to a weakness in God, a line of questioning, a logical process which He can not endure. Or you can not resist, anyway

No, this is admitting to a weakness in BELIEVERS, not God. A line of questioning, a logical process which WE can not endure. As I asked, how would you feel if your daughter questioned you to this degree about your being her true father?

As I said before, I believe there are some things that God never intended HIS PEOPLE to even WANT to question.

Becky

[hopefulpilgrim]

I think we've got some laggers, angelo. C'mon guys, get up to speed!!! By the way, I forgot to mention, Cal Ripken's last game was really something. HE went 0 for 3, but the celebration surrounding his last game was awesome. What a guy!! These days, positive role models of his caliber are hard to come by... OK---that's all, I'll shut up now about Cal Ripken, Jr.

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Oh really? Big Mack never set down with the Bible and tried to show you the truth? (Or you, him.) You never look in other books, listen to your pastor, read a concordance, listen or watch religious programs?

I have done all these things. But I BELIEVE becasue of what God says in His Word. Not becasue of what Big Mack or anyone else says. God proved himself to me in the bible numerous times. He does not need to be vindicated for me by man.

But of course that is to simple a concept for you to agree with, right, not enough thinking involved:)

Becky

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Oh really? Big Mack never set down with the Bible and tried to show you the truth? (Or you, him.) You never look in other books, listen to your pastor, read a concordance, listen or watch religious programs?

I have done all these things. But I BELIEVE becasue of what God says in His Word. Not becasue of what Big Mack or anyone else says. God proved himself to me in the bible numerous times. He does not need to be vindicated for me by man.

But of course that is to simple a concept for you to agree with, right, not enough thinking involved:)

Becky

[SoothingDave]

I think we've got some laggers, angelo. C'mon guys, get up to speed!!!

If only we had some lagers.

By the way, I forgot to mention, Cal Ripken's last game was really something. HE went 0 for 3, but the celebration surrounding his last game was awesome. What a guy!! These days, positive role models of his caliber are hard to come by... OK---that's all, I'll shut up now about Cal Ripken, Jr.

That's baseball, right? (Or as close as they get to baseball in the American League.) Didn't that use to be America's pasttime?

SD

[SoothingDave]

No, this is admitting to a weakness in BELIEVERS, not God.

Fair enough, I figured that was what you meant.

As I said before, I believe there are some things that God never intended HIS PEOPLE to even WANT to question.

You can believe that if you like, but I can't. Certainly cunning sophists can lead away those less grounded in faith, and those types of people should be sheltered. But I'm a big boy and my faith can stand up to examination and conjecture. Granted, there are some questions that I just have to answer on pure faith, but many can be reasoned from principle elements of faith.

SD

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

<>First of all, I do not ask because I don't know the answer.

Exactly! I went back and looked at my responses and I was speaking of BELIEVERS asking the type of questions that have been coming up here the longer we go on.

I ask because I want to see what answers I get from the other folks. You know. The folks here relying on the Holy Spirit to personally deliver them to all truth. I find there answers and methodologies interesting. Don't you?

Exactly!! The more and more of these questions that are asked, and in trying to answer such questions the human mind can't but we try and sometimes it all comes out wrong, because God never intended to be question to this degree, so the answers are coming from are finite (sp) minds not from the Holy Spirit guiding us. The questions are trick questions. I don't beleive God would approve of that. Are you doing it to teach, or just to be able to say "Gotcha" Just as you would never want to do a DNA test to prove to your daughter that you are her father would you?

Becky

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Fair enough, I figured that was what you meant.

Then why did you ask? Just trying to trip someone up. Shame.:(

Becky

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

As I said before, I believe there are some things that God never intended HIS PEOPLE to even WANT to question.

You can believe that if you like, but I can't. Certainly cunning sophists can lead away those less grounded in faith, and those types of people should be sheltered. But I'm a big boy and my faith can stand up to examination and conjecture. Granted, there are some questions that I just have to answer on pure faith, but many can be reasoned from principle elements of faith

Do you want your daughter questioning her parentage? Please answer how this question makes you feel.

Becky

[SoothingDave]

I went back and looked at my responses and I was speaking of BELIEVERS asking the type of questions that have been coming up here the longer we go on.

Some of my questions bother you because they are not what a believer would ask. In fact, they are the types of questions asked by non-believers, or skeptics. By asking these questions it prepares us to win over the hearts and minds of the non-believer. If confonted by one with a similar question, he will not be satisfied with "God doesn't want us to ask these questions." And he will see it as a weakness in our God.

I at least try to prepare to answer these types of questions, to be able to meet this type of challenge.

(Not that I totally accpet your premise that a true believer wouldn't question such things.)

SD

[SoothingDave]

Do you want your daughter questioning her parentage? Please answer how this question makes you feel.

This question makes me feel sad and disappointed.

Of course what relation it has to the very real human history of writing, compiling and canonizing the Bible is another issue.

And what it has to do with the interpretation of items within said Bible is also different.

SD

[SoothingDave]

Children below the age of reason quite properly take everything on the authority of their parents. After the age of reason, they quite properly test these things against evidence and reason. This anti-reason approach of yours fits well with the caricature the skeptics like to paint of believers.

But didn't Jesus say we should be like children to enter the Kingdom?

SD

[Invincibly Ignorant]

Children below the age of reason quite properly take everything on the authority of their parents. After the age of reason, they quite properly test these things against evidence and reason. This anti-reason approach of yours fits well with the caricature the skeptics like to paint of believers.

Go figure. Are these those same children that have no choice of whether or not they should repent and be baptized? You know, the ones that get baptized anyway.

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Of course what relation it has to the very real human history of writing, compiling and canonizing the Bible is another issue.

The relation is not trusting that God can control what and how the bible was written, compiled and cannonizied. Do you believe it is God's Word or not? If you believe that MAN wrote and compiled and canonized the bible then no it isn't God's word. If you believe that God controled it, then BELEIVERS should not have to ask these questions.

And what it has to do with the interpretation of items within said Bible is also different

Do you trust what Gods says, as you want your daughter to trust what you say. God says he will send the Holy Spirit to teach us all things, and no man need teach us. 1 John 2:27.

Becky

[SoothingDave]

Yes, and that statement pertains to trust in God, not in parents, and cannot be interpreted to contradict my statement. Indeed, Jesus gave his disciples plenty of evidence to believe in him, in the form of miracles, to prove his authority. In like manner, Peter an Paul worked miracles before the Gentiles to prove their authority. "Believe it because I say so," is a legitimate appeal only after authority has been established.

But doesn't that mean that my faith in God should be like that of a child, absolutely trusting without examining any evidence, or even knowing that I should examine my faith?

SD