Posted on 10/06/2001 6:16:58 PM PDT by Dengar01
I just got home from church and I had to post this. I attended Willow Creek church which is north west of Chicago. It is the largest church in the area, it is a non-denominational Christian church, the main auditorium hold 10,000 people and was filled tonight. The topic of the 5:00 service tonight was the interview with a Muslim named Iama Fisal Hammounda, by Senior Pastor Bill Hybels. They will be having three more services between tonight and tomorrow, I pray to God they change their plans for the next services.
I knew this was going to get ugly when the church showed a video on ethnic diversity. I looked around at the church filled to capacity with over 10,000 people and noticed several Muslims.
The inteview started and the man was introduced as a Egyptian who moved here in 1974. He complained that his wife was in Florida and couldn't come home due to the fact that she would be harassed. The goal of Pastor Hybel's interview was to prove that Islam is a peaceful religion, lets just say that he failed, miserabley.
Pastor Hybels did ask some very good questions which surprised me since I thought the Muslim might take the questions as offensive. A few questions statements stood out. The Muslim declared that Islam was peaceful and that the terrorists did not follow Islam, fine I guess. He continued that a "Jihad" had to do with attacking sin he made the poor analogy of declaring a jihad on eating candy.
Continuing Pastor Hybels asked him about martyrs along with the virgins and the streams of wine and the Muslim responded I pray for that to happen. He was truly innappropriate and this is when everything went downhill.
After the Muslims were jumping for joy with the Mr. Hammounda's innappropriate remarks, many people got up and walked out disgusted. I stayed to hear his next remarks which stunned me worse than his previous remarks.
That is when I walked out.
Fortunately for me to write this my sister and her husband stayed while I was complaining to several people at the Service Desk. The final statement which I was lucky enough to miss finished with Mr. Hammounda saying that Christians and Muslims can be friends, only on Muslims terms.
Yes you heard it the slime being spewed by the left is false. I heard it first hand from this man answering innappropriately while joking about a serious issue. I made the statement that this was unnacceptable for a church and should not be tolerated.
If you agree with me you can FReep the church at:
Willow Creek Community Church
67 E. Algonquin Road
South Barrington, IL 60010
(847) 765-5000
Fax: (847) 765-9222
General e-mail: info@willowcreek.org
Don't worry because the church had many people furious, about 200 people walked out including myself and many people were venting their frustration to people who work at the church. I will be calling the church tomorrow to let them know how I feel.
Yesterday on Fox News Channel, I videotaped "Patty Ann" (the host of a program around 9 AM). She said this:
It is said that "bin Laden is engaged in a holy war and the goal is to eliminate anyone who is not Islamic."
She then read these excerpted passages out of the Koran, which were written by Mohammed, himself:
[1] "Strongest among men in emnity to *the believers* wilt thou find the Jews and the pagans."
[2] "So fight and slay the pagans where ever you find them. Seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem [trick/deceit] of war, until they embrace Islam." ~
So ... was Mohammed, the founder of Islam, himself, a "peaceful" moderate?
Chapters from the Koran. Excerpted Introductory Note:
"THE ANCIENT religion of the Arabs was the worship of the stars ... long before the birth of Mohammed. ... The chief seat of this ... worship was the city of Mecca...".
1 Mohammed was born in 571 A. D. His father died before he was born, and his mother when he was only six. In his youth he tended sheep and goats, and at twenty-four he was employed to drive caravans of camels by a rich widow, ‘Hadïgah, whom he married.
2 When he was forty, while wandering alone on a desolate mountain near Mecca, he had a vision. An angel appeared to him and told him to read, and recited certain verses.
From youth he had suffered from a kind of hysteria, and this vision seems to have increased his tendency to hallucinations and ecstasy.
There was an intermission of two or three years before the vision reappeared, after which revelations came rapidly.
He became convinced of his prophetic mission, and began to make converts, the first being the **women** of his own family.
3 For years, however, the new religion made little progress, and the prophet underwent great hardships, finally having to flee from Mecca to Medinah. From this “Flight,” which took place in 622 A. D., the Mohammedan era dates.
Two years later began the Holy War, and from this time on Mohammedanism was extended largely by the sword.
When its founder died in 632, it was firmly established as a great political power as well as a religion; and it is now said to be the belief of about a hundred and seventy millions of people.
4 From the Qur’ân or Koran, in which are collected Mohammed’s revelations, the following chapters are selected to give a view of all the more important elements of the faith he taught. ~
Go to The Harvard Classics 1909–14 web site to read the chapters HERE
True "unity" will always be around __the truth__.
Here is "truth":
The Christian Worldview is the only worldview that recognizes that [1] All human "rights and freedoms" are "inaliable" because, according to the Holy Scriptures, they come from man's creator, God. [2] The only "legitimate" government is one that is LIMITED and is based upon "THE RULE OF LAW". [3] DEFENDS AND PROTECTS the God-given rights and freedoms of it's citizens BY PUNISHING evil-doers (the lawless) SWIFTLY.
Tyrants / Dictators cannot agree with "limited government", nor do they agree that human rights come from God, and are therefore inalieable.
THAT is the reason that the United States (because of our Constitution, and other founding documents) present a THREAT to tyrants and dictators. We stand in their way.
A tyrant that tries to FORCE his *religion* down people's throats with "the sword" is not a "peaceful" person.
Those who support his efforts (overtly or covertly), are not peaceful persons, either.
See reply #141.
Has Islam been hijacked or overwhelmed by extremists? No, we are just watching the natural outcome of the Islamic revival that began after World War II.
Yeah, he seems to fit a similar profile to Joseph Smith, the con artist who was responsible for founding the Mormon religion. Joseph Smith was visited by a similar angel. Thank God that the Book of Mormon is really a novel that was written by a retired Methodist minister named Simon Spalding. Joseph Smith had a buddy who worked as an apprentice in the print shop where Simon Spalding took his manuscript to be printed. This manuscript mysteriously disappeared from the print shop and 'reappeared' within months after Simon Spalding died. It is these manuscripts that Joseph Smith 'magically' translated from behind a curtain, and he print shop buddy is one of the few there to witness this holy translation. Ha!
Sounds like Mohammed, due to being born in a more ignorant time, gained more followers and delivered a much more deadly message.
Oh yes, Pastor Hybel, who gave Bill Clinton a forum before the DNC's national convention! I have no respect for Pastor Hybel! He is a very misguided man! Period!
Singing Onward Christian Soldiers*grin*
Ya might want to look at Saddleback Baptist in Cal.,the 2nd largest church in the nation..my church has bought and uses their "church growth "material...I believe that the word of God never returns void,I believe the church is built by Christ..but these mega churches "market "their churches like deoderant..a "target population",demographics etc...
It is not God!
The church boasts a congregation of 4,000 + (based on members) - and weekend services that bring in 12,000 + - but I question if they have ever calculated the turnover rate of those who walk in the front door and exit out the back without ever a comment to the "people up stairs."
Unfortunately, as with most things, it is the power that has corrupted Willow. Its aim and goal was innocent, but its success has destroyed it, and unfortunately not enough people notice. Instead, like me and the Rogmonster, we simply walk out one day and don't return. Hybels in his heart thought he was doing the right thing. Unforunately, Hybels has determined that what Hybels decides is the right thing means it is a message from God.
Too many common threads run through the prayers that the terrorists verbalized, such as God open all doors, and the prayers that are often verbalized by Hybels. I hope that someday he will realize that it is absolute power that has corrupted so absolutely the church that he heads.......
It is a sad day when we let them do that, as if we accepted the protection from those murderous mobsters.
After reading many of the posts I have but one thing to say:
Perhaps if you return to this 'church' for another service you might try just standing and turning your back to the speaker when this stuff starts up again.
WATCH, STAND FAST IN THE FAITH, BE BRAVE, BE STRONG. 1Cor 16:13
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