GROUND ZERO'S BLESSED CROSS

New York Post ^ | 10/05/01 | ROD DREHER

[RobbyS]

Funny, these minipopes who say the Bible is open to all and then deny you the right to interpret the Bible as saying something that what HE says it says.

[Unbeliever]

All of the above quotes are easily interpretable as supporting the Catholic position. Furthermore, we have evidence from the writings of the Early Church Fathers that we have believed in the Real Presence from the very beginning. But there are still many who cannot accept this hard saying.

Sure, but only if you throw aside the actual meaning of the words and accept romes' unBiblical substitution.

[Unbeliever]

Yeah, and we're always calling those Taliban guys haters, too, just because they disagree with our ideology.

rome, like the Taliban also has a history of large scale murder.

[jrherreid]

rome, like the Taliban also has a history of large scale murder.

End of conversation, I presume. Unwarrented bigotry is hardly the best way to win an argument.

You both have a set view in your minds of what the Catholic Church is, and no evidence to the contrary will sway it. Whatever does not fit into your pre-concieved notions is deemed untruthful or erroneous. Argument cannot win you over, nor can the facts. I can only pray that the hardness of your hearts is softened in the coming years, and that the veil of ignorance is lifted.

Until then, so long.

John

[Unbeliever]

Funny, these minipopes who say the Bible is open to all and then deny you the right to interpret the Bible as saying something that what HE says it says.

I'm getting really tired of the way you people have been trained to reflexively label Christians "haters" and "mini-popes" without ever being able to demonstrate that the words of Holy Bible mean anything other that what is actually written.
You could start with explaining why Jesus STILL called the wine "fruit of the vine" AFTER you claim he converted it into HIS blood. Also you need to explain why in I CORINTHIANS 11:24-34 the bread is STILL repeatedly called bread.
Lay off the myths about what you call "early christians" who were not in fact Christians but a combination of faithless former church members who valued their lives above the Gospel and the remanant of roman pagan cults who combined to form your catholic "church". The New Testament was written under the inspiration of God by the first Christians and your catechism frequently conflicts with it.

[Unbeliever]

End of conversation, I presume. Unwarrented bigotry is hardly the best way to win an argument.
You both have a set view in your minds of what the Catholic Church is, and no evidence to the contrary will sway it. Whatever does not fit into your pre-concieved notions is deemed untruthful or erroneous. Argument cannot win you over, nor can the facts. I can only pray that the hardness of your hearts is softened in the coming years, and that the veil of ignorance is lifted.
Until then, so long.

Translation = time to pout.
Hey! While you're pouting why don't you ACTUALLY READ THE HOLY BIBLE yourself?

[Texas Mom]

And this verse has what to do with some catholic idolators worshipping a piece of wreckage?

I don't think anyone is worshipping the cross. They may be worshipping "AT" the cross which is totally different..

[jrherreid]

Hey! While you're pouting why don't you ACTUALLY READ THE HOLY BIBLE yourself?

I wasn't going to reply--but this just irks me beyond belief. WE CATHOLICS DO READ THE BIBLE. I have read it many times. It is read every day at Mass. It is read several times a day in the Daily Office. Most of the rudimentary prayers are directly from Scripture. But one thing we are not--we are not Bibliolaters like yourself.

[RobbyS]

without ever being able to demonstrate that the words of Holy Bible mean anything other that what is actually written. The problem is, Bub, that you don't accept that the Scripture you cite can be interpreted differently. But as Luther pointed out , pointing the table for emphasis in a famous confrontation with Zwingli, the Scripture says: This IS my Body. Now if you want to interpret it symbolically then go right ahead, but it is STILL just YOUR reading against mine and Marty Lutter's and the great majority of Christians throughout the ages.

[Wm Bach]

Do me a favor and don't pray to any idols on my behalf.

Last time I checked, God wasn't an idol. I pray you'll learn to deal with your parochialism one of these days and accept Christ in your heart, not just as a bludgeon. It's a wonderous thing when that happen. Indeed, it's a miracle!

I forgive you. I pray God does, too!

[Hegewisch Dupa]

You are a good man, WB; certainly better than me (although that is certainly a case of damning with faint praise). I would never have the patience or concern to waste on praying for unbeliever - but thank God (literally!) people like you do. Preaching to the saved isn't the most productive way to spread the Gospel; certainly it made more sense for Christ to hang with tax collectors and prostitutes - those desperately in need of The Word.

For me, I see the hatred unbeliever spews forth and wonder "What type of religion supports such filth?" Then I realize, like the recent recipients of our military hardware, or like the Klan in our very own country, that no religion supports such hatred toward other groups. What we have here is a failure for people to follow God's communiqué; and a twisting of His words into an excuse to hate other groups. It's sad, desperately so, but your understanding, and invoking of God's help is the best way to deal with an individual [cruise missiles work well with large dangerous and hopeless groups ;)] and make one's life worthwhile again. Hopefully some day unbeliever and those like him can rip off the glasses of hatred and enjoy God's creation, and relish in His Truth. You truly are a good man, WB.

[rogers21774]

I think this story is getting out of hand. Don't get me wrong, I'm a Christian and believe in the power of God, but I don't consider this a sign from God anymore than I believe God had anything to do with the tragedy in the first place.

I'm a firm believer in miracles, but let's not get too excited over coincedence. The true miracles are those who were in or around the buildings when they collapsed and survived.

[ELS]

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