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Lives of the Twelve Caesars: Nero
Ancient History Sourcebook ^ | Suetonius

Posted on 10/01/2001 3:52:20 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage

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To: Bumpster
Bump
41 posted on 10/01/2001 5:55:00 PM PDT by MHGinTN
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To: A.J.Armitage
Thanks A.J. -- I promise to post some Boethius soon.
43 posted on 10/01/2001 6:27:20 PM PDT by primeval patriot
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Comment #44 Removed by Moderator

To: A.J.Armitage
Really enjoyed the read, thanks for the bump.
45 posted on 10/01/2001 7:08:27 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: primeval patriot
I promise to post some Boethius soon.

Please bump me when you do.

46 posted on 10/01/2001 8:19:43 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: A.J.Armitage
Thanks, guy. (Nero came up just this evening at RCIA, strangely enough.)

Have a quote in my notes about the transcending of history (an "eternal present" of sorts) available in the sacraments ... as well as the sacrilegious, it seems.

47 posted on 10/01/2001 8:47:03 PM PDT by Askel5
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To: Agrarian
So a controlling mother deprives him of wisdom and perspective that may have made him a better ruler, and a "wise teacher" out of personal pride, keeps him from being exposed to wisdom from other ages. Interesting -- the education of a tyrant in progress. Kind of makes one wonder about FDR's days as a school boy.....

Good observation. I doubt she would have denied him the study of philosophy if they'd had Nietzsche, but as it was the philosophy he would have studied would've been Stoicism.

Your post brings up an interesting question: what kind of education should Caesar have? It would seem that the question would be particularly important in America, since, in theory at least, everyone takes up part of Caesar's role, but I haven't seen much discussion of it. Our education usually turns out worker bees instead. Critics of the education system usually talk about being prepared to get good jobs. That's important, of course, because you've got to eat, but that can't be all of it. Beefing up civics won't be enough either, because an educated citizen needs more than the ability to recite the three branches of government.

I had a look back at the Cicero thread just after posting this one, and something caught my eye that hadn't earlier. "Chiltown", which struck me as more utopian(in the good sense) than any of the political utopias, from Plato to Marx. I'm reading the Republic now, and in some ways it was like Socrates' first ideal city, which was rejected by his companions, in that it's a place for actual people, where the pleasures are ones that people can actually enjoy, not a happy city of unhappy men. I don't know if it's relevant to anything, it just struck me.

48 posted on 10/01/2001 9:09:34 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: Askel5
Have a quote in my notes about the transcending of history (an "eternal present" of sorts) available in the sacraments ... as well as the sacrilegious, it seems.

Perhaps relating to the two eternal destinations. Or maybe not. :-)

49 posted on 10/01/2001 9:18:29 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: Paleo_list
Starting out the list I added here.
50 posted on 10/01/2001 9:20:46 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: A.J.Armitage
I suspect the one's a Dead End, actually.
51 posted on 10/01/2001 9:24:58 PM PDT by Askel5
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To: A.J.Armitage
BUMP. Thanks.
52 posted on 10/02/2001 9:12:59 AM PDT by sheltonmac
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To: Billthedrill
His persecution of Christians as scapegoats in that fire was opportunistic and cowardly, but not, evidently, done out of any particular animus for that new religion.

It was Nero who called Christians "enemies of mankind." That sounds like a pretty particularized animus to me.

Nero's anti-Christian animus is repeated often here, usually by gay activist athiests. That isn't surprising given that they and Nero speak from a common spirit.

53 posted on 10/02/2001 9:20:53 AM PDT by Kevin Curry
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Comment #54 Removed by Moderator

To: Agrarian
As a sidelight, I would furthermore stipulate that humility is not at all the same thing as self-loathing. Somehow our educational system here creates a people that is simultaneously self-loathing and arrogant. One struggles to imagine how such a thing could be possible, but there it is -- true stranger than fiction.

It may be that they lack perspective on themselves. The kind of humility that comes from the liberal education you described is the kind that comes from putting yourself in perspective. Our problem in America isn't so much the pride of an individual person(although that can be a problem too, as Bill Clinton, and before him the likes of Aaron Burr, demonstrated), as it is the general lack of perspective on the part of politicians and citizens. People aren't usually exposed to thoughts and history that aren't from the recent past, if that.

You're right about the study of the classics. An educated citizen or statesman ought to know the Greek and Latin classics, plus the writings of the Founding Fathers and authors like Bastiat, and other modern classics.

55 posted on 10/02/2001 4:47:19 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: A.J.Armitage
Thank you for posting.
56 posted on 10/02/2001 7:23:23 PM PDT by Marianne
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Comment #57 Removed by Moderator

To: Agrarian
Somehow I don't think he's on most "must read" lists outside of libertariann circles.

That's true, but he's still really good. If you took the most libertarian aspects of Locke(the ones I picked up, of course), you'd get Bastiat. His most famous work is The Law, which is also contained in Selected Essays in Political Economy.

Bastiat is probably the most underrated writer of all time. I really wish he was more well known. He was a French economist and politician in the 19th century.

I must also confess that I have a terribly hard time reading and being interested in economics of any stripe.

So do I, actually. Bastiat's a lot more interesting than most economic writers.

I wouldn't make a very good libertarian....

< cult like chanting >Come, join us.< /cult like chanting >

58 posted on 10/02/2001 9:19:32 PM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: A.J.Armitage
Just got back online since 9/11. In temporary quarters in upper Manhattan.Thanks for the article. I have kept them all. Will get to this ASAP.
59 posted on 10/17/2001 8:08:44 AM PDT by stanz
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To: stanz
I hope no one you know was hurt.
60 posted on 10/17/2001 9:52:39 AM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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