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Lew Rockwell ^ | 9/24/01 | Jeff Elkins

Posted on 09/24/2001 3:10:00 AM PDT by Ada Coddington

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To: DB
Thanks for proving my point.
81 posted on 09/24/2001 5:39:43 AM PDT by GeorgeF
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To: DB
Well then what is it Mr. Knowitall?
82 posted on 09/24/2001 5:41:48 AM PDT by GeorgeF
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To: Robert-J

"The atmosphere there is now poisonous."

I'm all too familiar with poisonous atmosphere - like that which this writers dripping fangs bring. Obviously, these poor critters aren't feeling well. Give this ilk some room FReepers, they'll slither back to their holes.
83 posted on 09/24/2001 5:44:57 AM PDT by Ron C.
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To: Nuke'm Glowing
We are.

Who the h*ll are "we"?

For that matter, who the h*ll are you?

Following the moderators guidelines, you should be banned for your name alone.

84 posted on 09/24/2001 5:46:01 AM PDT by Osinski
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To: Sandy
Traitors? No. Some tin foil, yes. I'm not going to panic or get excited about anything "PROPOSED" until the final law is enacted or coming up for a vote. Otherwise we're just wasting breath and bandwidth. Contact your congress person and let them know how you feel. My opinions on that piece of work is still being formulated, though not overly positive at this point in time.
85 posted on 09/24/2001 5:48:34 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: Abundy
Sure, the adults are in charge now - but what happens after things calm down and the Media goes back to supporting a bunch of Socialists and the next thing you know Hillary and Schumer are President and VP? Do you really think they can be trusted with more power? I don't.

I hate to seem callous to the pain of the families but this is the thing that has haunted me almost from the beginning. The first time I heard the phrase "Our lives will never be the same again" something deep inside started to quiver. As I watched the uniformed soldiers telling people to show their IDs my heart sank. This is not going to turn out well.

Since my state instituted DUI roadblocks, I have rehearsed, in my mind, exactly what I would say should I encounter one and how I would behave. Most of the scenarios don't have me merrily going on my way. So be it, but unless I am, for good cause ( ie. other than being at the wrong place at the wrong time) suspect of a crime, I will not answer "where have you been and where are you going".

Now it seems there may be more checkpoints for me to run mental scenarios on. I flash back to the movie "Hunt for Red October" wherein on of the Soviet officers was amazed that we were free to move from state to state without showing our papers and I wonder how long that will be possible.

As far as I'm concerned, foreign visitors, students, guest workers should be implanted with a chip like a pet's ID chip. However it should have tracking capabilities and maybe even some pain producing device so that if they aren't out of the country by the time they said they would be, they'd wish they were. I don't care what we do to non citizens. I just want to be left alone. I don't want an ID card. I don't want face recognition cameras on every corner. When I found out the technology existed to track cellphones to such a precise degree that they used the victim's phones to locate their bodies in that rubble, I tossed the cellphone.

I know this is war and I understand the willingness to extend the power of the government during times of insecurity. I take that back. I don't understand it because I, too, worry about the powers we give now, to this administration, in the hands of some future administration. Seeing how billyboy used the government to affect those who criticized him ....well that's what's ruining my sleep.

86 posted on 09/24/2001 5:49:04 AM PDT by snorkeler
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To: Osinski
We are the apparent majority who disagree with you. The moderator has not emailed nor indicated any disapproval with my nick. If you are that sensitive, I might suggest the Sierra Club board or maybe even the www.antiwar.com board. But there are two extremes at work here: the tin foil libertarian loons and the leftist liberal anti-American socialists. Name the camp you are in. I believe in free speech, soundly. But ranting paranoia, nah, I'll pass on my tolerance for that, it's getting old.
87 posted on 09/24/2001 5:53:02 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: Osinski
Was there something in particular?

Nope. They just wanted him gone.

88 posted on 09/24/2001 5:53:52 AM PDT by Inspector Harry Callahan
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To: Nuke'm Glowing
There are only a few LP members who write for LRC. Elkins isn't one of them, according to some of his earlier columns. Constitutionalists are getting as much bashing these days as liberals are. I don't understand why.

There's a big difference between loyalty to country and letting politicians get by with wiping their backsides on the Constitution to cover their own treason.

Wait until the demand for a declaration of war is really pressed in Congress. Part of the deal from the left side of the aisle will be a demand for another Sedition Act as a price for agreement to declaring war. You can bet on that. The traitors will want cover in time of war, when the price of treason is to be paid at the end of a rope. They'll want any criticism of government suppressed so that evidence of what they've done can't be used to get them out of office.

89 posted on 09/24/2001 5:56:02 AM PDT by Twodees
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To: Abundy
In a nationwide poll released Sunday, a stunning 85% of Brits would welcome a national ID card system in the wake of the terrorist attacks on the United States, with an overwhelming majority calling for the cards to be packed with information to clearly identify the holder: These include photograph (97%), date of birth (96%) eye color (92%), a finger print (85%), DNA details (75%), criminal records (74%) and religion (67%).

I think I am going to be sick... I voluntarily give some of this info to be liscensed to drive and do other things. MY choice but to be compelled to do so, and include my DNA and relgion? I think I am going to be sick.

90 posted on 09/24/2001 5:58:53 AM PDT by snorkeler
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To: Nuke'm Glowing
Paranoia? If you want to hear paranoia listen to some of the conservatives on FR. I've read calls (on other threads)for rationing (even though there is no shortage of any important goods), blackouts (whatever for? Didn't you notice that the attacks took place in broad daylight?), checkpoints, and on and on. They cry that this will make us "safe". The government that can't teach children to read, make us safe? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

I think it's time to calm down. We shouldn't have a "Department of Homeland Security" for the simple reason that we don't need one. We don't need to censor the Internet or give the FBI carte blanche. We can fight, and fight hard and well, without going nuts.
91 posted on 09/24/2001 6:00:39 AM PDT by alpowolf
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To: GeorgeF
I you think what I said proves me to be a fascist then you don't know what a fascist is. I made no effort to prevent you from speaking or banning you.
92 posted on 09/24/2001 6:01:13 AM PDT by DB
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To: Twodees
That I won't disagree with. And the national ID card is a joke. I'm currently at home laid up from a car accident from an individual who got a state driver's liscense with a falsified address. What makes ANYONE think the national ID card is going to help? That's one subject I've not broached because the concept is so mindless it's not even funny.
93 posted on 09/24/2001 6:01:17 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: alpowolf
Don't label all those that call for that as "conservatives"...there are quite a few libs calling for the same and even more!
94 posted on 09/24/2001 6:02:40 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: alpowolf
And yes, I find the paranoia on both sides of the aisle, frightening but amusing...
95 posted on 09/24/2001 6:03:25 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: Ada Coddington
Old essay exam trick...If you do not know what you are talking about regarding topic A compare topic A with topic B which you think you might know something about and write essay answer about topic B. nuff said.

Do you know that if cats get in to catmip and eat enough of it the will get diarrhea.

96 posted on 09/24/2001 6:07:05 AM PDT by DeckTheHallsHolly
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To: Nuke'm Glowing
We are the apparent majority who disagree with you.

You and your mother?

97 posted on 09/24/2001 6:07:38 AM PDT by Osinski
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To: knarf
In addition to finally getting after terrorism we have an unprecedented chance to roll back PC and illegal immigration for votes programs.
98 posted on 09/24/2001 6:08:37 AM PDT by Righty1
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To: Osinski
Ah, now we bring my mother into it. A liberal to the end obviously. Or a tinfoil apologist? Which is it, the public wants to know?
99 posted on 09/24/2001 6:09:00 AM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: Ada Coddington
It’s also funny that it’s always assumed that human behavior in the past has no relation to how we behave today. Why those people were old-fashioned, we’re modern, educated, etc.

Oh yes, the words from the article, like sanctimonious, come to mind.
Odd, how hyperbole is dismissed after contemplating the aftermath of Mass Murder, and the enemy is dismissed silently, and presumably as more or less innocent.

Aside from the fact that the overwhelming discussion here has been civil (yes, angry but civil) and insightful, this clymer picks the worst examples of rage as typical Freeper fare, as has the Democratic Underground. Sort of gives me a clue as to where he's coming from.

Human behavior in the past does have a definite relation to how we behave today; and even more so for the Muslim World. Let's look at the main significance of that as it relates to the total silence in the article about it.

All of the Muslim Middle East countries have been aiding indirectly or supporting directly terrorist activities and training camps all over the place; there may be dozens or hundreds of them.
We have been pretending not to notice so long as it was "not too bad" and didn't affect us directly.
They have pretended to forgive us for the mild criticism we do deliver from time to time, and gladly keep their cartel going to generate the millions the terrorists get indirectly from us.
Yeah, let's talk behavior from the past.

But even more insidiously and perfidiously, the current war has been characterized as non-religious when it is plainly so. The daily proclamations from all Muslim countries to "kill Americans" is not imaginary, and to most literate adults plain enough to see. And the muslim population in the U.S. has been totally silent in providing any aid to fellow citizens in this country even after the Mass Murder.
Most Americans also have no difficulty in assessing the odds of 11 000 000 Muslims in the U.S., with hundreds of terrorists operating among them, and actually getting help and aid and comfort among them, all being totally clueless of the plans of the terrorists and their actual acts of Mass Murder.

So then, let's talk about behavior from the past.
When national survival, and our civil liberties are on the line, you bet, Mr. Elkins, that our current rage at the Mass Murder is based on the crystal clarity that past behavior is very indicative of present and future conscious intent by the Muslim community worldwide!

100 posted on 09/24/2001 6:14:17 AM PDT by Publius6961
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