Posted on 09/17/2001 11:55:01 PM PDT by kattracks
Edited on 07/12/2004 3:47:02 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
U.S. intelligence officials are investigating ties between the terrorists who carried out suicide airliner attacks and associates of Osama bin Laden based in Albania.
The connections were described as support for the terrorist operation to hijack U.S. commercial jetliners and crash them into the Pentagon and the World Trade Center, according to U.S. intelligence officials.
(Excerpt) Read more at washtimes.com ...
Of course, while we are entrenched in European battles protecting muslim terrorists, they are planning our destruction. Course Milosevic is the true enemy here...since he battled these forces against our will.
Now now Bluester, I seem to remember you calling us Milo supporters for not agreeing with you
Try HRW, Amnesty International, The International Committee of the Red Cross, and recent reports filtering out of Serbia iteself regarding the exhumations of Kosovar Albanians interred there during and immediately following Allied Force.
You can believe an oversimplified player's list and team roster put before you by dissappointed Serb Nationalists, or you can figure out the relationships and why we acted as we did with whom we did on your own.
Pardon me if I don't forgive you if you don't.
No, it stands for organization. .gov is the internet postfix that denotes a government site.
From the link: "The Wall Street Journal now has learned many of the refugees' tales of atrocities were told not to independent human rights activists but to the KLA, which had a vested interest in embellishing and fabricating the facts."
As for the bodies found in Serbia itself, yup, I'm sure some of the terrorists were executed, just as we would execute them here if we caught them alive. And I'll concede that many others were probably enemies of Milosevic (Serb, Albanian, or other) who were "educated" of the error of their ways. If that's the case, then he should be held responsible. But the KLA is also reported by the HRW to have killed Albanians who "collaborated" with the Serbs. Where is your outrage at this?
That war was going on long before Milosevic came into power, and just because he was a bad guy doesn't mean we allied ourselves with the good guys.
The American goal now to is strike the Afghan air-defense grid as quickly as possible. Already much of it is being dismantled and hidden away. If America waits another week to neutralize these sites it will be too late. Then like Saddam's Scuds, they will always be a hidden threat -- popping up at the most inopportune times to deal US casualties.
Their maybe some air activity but this new war being somewhat of a covert one you seem to forget their are approx. 35 to 40 thousand Afghan fighters that oppose the Teliban and Bin Ladin. They control more than a third of Afghanistan and with the common cause now so obvious the anti aircraft guns may well stay deployed because it will not matter anyway. It will be interesting to find out what these anti Teliban pro U.S. fighters will have to say about the KLA and the heroin that the Afgahn Muslim extremists sell to the KLA so that the junkies in the United States can stay supplied. From what I hear the heroin was flowing even more up until Sept. 11 started to smolder. Fusion the so called KLA association with the U.S. and now the Serb support for the U.S. means that the KLA/honeymoon maybe over. The U.S. knows the difference and are not fools. Remember Bush Jr. is on the war path against terrorists and the KLA seem to hang and get supplied with the likes of Bin Ladin and his boys. You know that Muslim extremists and American mix like vinegar and water so why mention to the world that Muslim extremists are helping the KLA cause. Would make the U.S. very on edge and these days you never know what can happen. Funny how things can change over night. Mirupafshim Fusion.
I reiterate, my info doesn't come from the KLA.
I've always stated that the KLA are a bunch of Marxist losers - Milosevic had the bad sense to follow his political instincts and become a worse player than they were, in the process turning what was a small group of families into the core of a nationalistic movement which offered the only opposition to a police and military force who's abysmal lack of concern for civil rights bit them in the ass whenever a Kosovar Albanian thought to himself "I'm not a KLA member, but the Police don't care about that when they stop us on the street...".
Milosevic made the KLA by sidelining Rugova as a viable alternative, and the KLA was his undoing. There's something fitting there.
Once Macedonia is stabilized, the KLA/NLA/UCPMB/whatever will fade back into the back alleys of the Balkans and get back to their small time hoodlum roots and spend their days competing with the Italian and Turkish Mafias to supply European Herion needs, instead of being relevant players on the international scene.
Lastly, you'll note we give terrorists trials here and don't play 'hide the bodies'.
I guess so, since Bin Laden was tied up with Russia at that time.
...and Milosevic's assaults on the Muslim residents of Bosnia and Kosovo had nothing to do with fighting Osama Bin Laden.
Those assaults, whether supported by Milo or not, went both ways.
I reiterate, my info doesn't come from the KLA.
Maybe not, but much of the ITCY's does.
Milosevic made the KLA by sidelining Rugova as a viable alternative, and the KLA was his undoing. There's something fitting there.
Milo never "made the KLA". In the elections last year, they were soundly thrashed by Rugova. NATO, who could have stabilized the Balkans, instead joined and armed the KLA. That's what made them. Non-Albanians in Kosovo and Macedonians have paid dearly for that decision.
Lastly, you'll note we give terrorists trials here and don't play 'hide the bodies'.
Granted, but should we now bomb every country that kills terrorists without a trial?
In years to come you will realise that it is not me being biased towards the Serbian people; it is you who refuse to treat Serbian people with respect or to see anything away from the poison spouted about Serbia by Nato. You judge everybody by the 'demons' painted by the media. Go there yourself and speak with people to understand how badly you have misjudged the country.
Statement by Russian Minister of Foreign Affairs Igor Ivanov at Airport on Arrival in Washington, September 19, 2001
1654-19-09-2001
Beginning my short working visit to Washington at the invitation of the US Secretary of State, I would like above all to express the solidarity of the leadership and people of Russia with the people of the United States, which came recently under barbaric terrorist attack. Together with it we grieve for the victims of this monstrous crime. The grief and outrage of America have echoed in the hearts of the citizens of Russia, who had personal experience of the horror of terrorist attacks. I will repeat the words of the Russian President, addressed to the people of the United States, we are with you, we wholly and entirely share your pain, we support you. Once again the fact has been borne home to all of us that terrorism knows no frontiers. Thrown down to all of civilized mankind, the impudent challenge requires a resolute rebuff. Combining the efforts of the whole international community in the fight against the terrorist threat is becoming imperative. It is necessary to cooperate more specifically and effectively, to make maximum use of bilateral and multilateral channels and to create an international legal base. We have practical proposals on that score. We expect this theme to be examined in depth and comprehensively at the upcoming talks in Washington.
During the visit my meetings are scheduled with US President George Bush, his national security adviser Condoleezza Rice, and a number of influential US Congress members. Naturally, we will hold several rounds of consultations with Colin Powell.
The main aim of the talks is the preparation of a meeting between Presidents Vladimir Putin and George Bush in Shanghai in October 2001 as part of the APEC summit, and of the visit to be paid by the President of the Russian Federation to the US in mid-October, 2001. The intensity of the Russian-American contacts already held recently and those upcoming is a striking testimony to the fact that our dialogue is acquiring positive dynamics, and bilateral relations the necessary durability and predictability.
Much of the attention in the Washington meetings at various levels, undoubtedly, will be devoted to questions of strategic stability. In particular, we will analyze the outcomes of the consultations held between the foreign affairs and defense agencies of the two countries on the interrelated issues of strategic offensive and defensive arms, as had been arranged by our Presidents in Genoa. A timetable for their continuation in the future also will be considered.
I think that a discussion of the most acute regional problems will also take place. Above all, this concerns the situation in the Middle East, in the Balkans and around Iraq. I must say that our approaches to many of the crisis situations are identical or similar, and the differences mainly concern tactical ways to resolve them.
In addition, I'm planning to touch on certain questions of development of trade and economic ties between Russia and the US. In this area some positive shifts have become evident of late, and we need to help in every way the consolidation of this tendency. A number of other questions of bilateral relations between our countries also will be considered.
_____________________________________
© Publication of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation. Reference is mandatory in case of reproduction.
Milo invalidated Rugova's policy of non-violent protest in the eyes of the majority of Kosovar Albanians by drawing the Serbs into violent responses against them whether they were KLA affiliated or not. Treat everybody like rebels, and soon they shall be.
So to answer your last, Milo wasn't only killing terrorists without trial, he was killing men, women, and children who had nothing to do with the KLA in his attempts to neutralize it.
Now's your chance to shine, Kate: Provide link for verification.
The one million refugees are from Bosnia and Croatia as well as Kosovo, and during the heydey of Serb Nationalism were sadly outnumbered by their Croat, Bosnian, and Kosovar Albanian counterparts. Hopefully they too will see their homes again.
What was achieved? 800,000 Kosovar Albanians returning home from refugee camps in Macedonia and Albania, along with more hundreds of thousands of internally displaced allowed to return home.
HRW based it's numbers on the White Book, so again, please provide your UN source, and try to figure out why Belgrade's public prosecutor used HRW's numbers in his indictment of NATO leaders.
Kate, I hold no personal animosity towards anybody in the region unless they've committed crimes personally - but if I have to see 1 man killed to stop another from killing hundreds, or watch as an airliner full of nuns and orphans is shot down to prevent it from being crashed into a skyscraper - so be it. Milosevic was warned that we would bomb him and his country if he didn't act like a decent human being for once, and he thought he could tough it out.
His mistake, Serbia's loss.
This is just amazing. It's a fact that Milosevic said that, loud and clear, and no one denied it! All media that reported about it delivered the same message. So please don't give me that "reputable news source".
If you haven't heard about this then I am really wondering what "established news sources" you have been reading and following. Obviously not all those you should.
It is just incredible how much of denial, doubt, questioning you are ready to show when it has anything to do with Milosevic and his responsibility, no matter how clear certain things are. Milosevic never denied his connections and support to the Serb military and paramilitary forces in Bosnia and elsewhere, as he did see no problem in that and considered it the best for Serbia's national interests. And I see that many people here still fall for it and consider him and people like Arkan, Mladic or Karadzic Serb patriots and freedom fighters.
Which is a very twisted logic. KLA are called terrorists (which they are), while those Serb paramilitary/terrorist forces that did the same things (killing civilians, massacring, raping women, burning houses, driving people from their homes) are supposed to be patriots. And I am supposed to buy this....
Fikret Abdic.
VRN
Albania's "freedom fighters" started their war for independence started long before Milosevic policies were invoked.
So to answer your last, Milo wasn't only killing terrorists without trial, he was killing men, women, and children who had nothing to do with the KLA in his attempts to neutralize it.
You mean like them and them? I acknowledge that Milosevic may have been guilty of murders, but not on the scale he's accused of (at least in Kosovo). And before you ask, of course that doesn't excuse him.
The vast majority were in their homes before NATO attacked, and here's more on what caused the refugee crisis prior to NATO's intervention. The refugee counts were matched, and the IDP count exceeded in Macedonia (when you take population and length of fighting into account), and seems to be a side-effect of every campaign waged by the KLA/NLA.
Then why don't you give me one.
If you haven't heard about this then I am really wondering what "established news sources" you have been reading and following. Obviously not all those you should.
I'm not perfect. If Milosevic did come out and admit that he supported the slaughters, than I missed it. I did nothing more than ask you for some links, and you go off on a tangent.
Milosevic never denied his connections and support to the Serb military and paramilitary forces in Bosnia and elsewhere, as he did see no problem in that and considered it the best for Serbia's national interests. And I see that many people here still fall for it and consider him and people like Arkan, Mladic or Karadzic Serb patriots and freedom fighters.
I don't, and it may be that he did support them, either with or without knowing what they did/would do. You're post seemed to say that he admitted he supported the massacres. I wasn't aware that he did admit to that, so I merely asked for references.
Of course, if the west backed him after he admitted...well, you get the picture.
Which is a very twisted logic. KLA are called terrorists (which they are), while those Serb paramilitary/terrorist forces that did the same things (killing civilians, massacring, raping women, burning houses, driving people from their homes) are supposed to be patriots. And I am supposed to buy this....
I have my doubts about many of the accusations because many have been shown to be false, but I don't excuse any Serb who committed these or any crimes.
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