[fortheDeclaration]

To GeorgeW.Bush-PLEASE! To beget-(1) to procreate as the father'(sire)

(2)to produce as an effect

Now, are you that obtuse or just dishonest!

You know very well what I meant, and my not putting it exactly right(the father does the 'begetting') does nothing to diminish the point!

Did God the Father 'beget' the Son in eternity?

If He did, you have a greater God and a 'lesser' God(which is how the JW's read it).

Are there two 'wills' in the Trinity?

If you want to discuss these issues-fine, if not, and you are going to close your mind to everything but the god of TULIP go to it!

Clearly you are more like Uriel, spudgin, doc, and Jerry M. then you realize. It must be the same Bible rejecting spirit!

Even so, come Lord Jesus.

[George W. Bush]

We really don't have anything to discuss if you are going to twist the word "beget".

Even so, come Lord Jesus. And please bring fortheDeclaraction a Bible dictionary so he (or she) won't be confused by the use of the word "beget" in its Biblical and theological context.

[George W. Bush]

To GeorgeW.Bush-PLEASE! To beget-(1) to procreate as the father'(sire) (2)to produce as an effect Now, are you that obtuse or just dishonest! Even if I were to adopt your second definition, it would still have Christ "produced as an effect" of the Father. I don't see how this actually alters the basic discussion.

If Christ is truly co-equal with the Father, then His absolute co-equality is a little less than "eternally begotten" or "produced as an effect". In either case, He proceeds from the Father. The Father is His source. Otherwise, the words "Son" and "Father" are stripped of any meaning whatsoever.

My explanations of the Trinity do not suffer the same handicaps. That's why I hold to them but do not consider them to be the basis of my own faith.

Your theological position has not improved in the slightest. You've merely demonstrated that the word "beget" is a mystery to you.

I'll challenge you to find a single instance of a woman "begetting" a child in the scripture. Find one or admit that "beget" means "to sire".

[RnMomof7]

A new issue for me..what does the creed mean when it says" Eternally begotten of the Father"..is that referring to jesus physical birth? "God from God"