Posted on 07/03/2024 7:12:31 PM PDT by Mariner
Kyiv has been told that, before it can join Nato, it must fix its problems with corruption. These are very real: the latest Corruption Perceptions Index ranks Ukraine below Belarus and Kazakhstan. But that is not the true reason why there will be no good news on accession for Zelensky at Nato’s 75th anniversary summit in Washington next week.
The simple reality is that very few in Nato wants to let Ukraine in, despite endless platitudes including a declaration by the North Atlantic Council at Vilnius last year that “Ukraine’s future is in Nato”. There has been discussion about taking that further at the July summit, but Joe Biden vehemently opposes anything more than the meaningless formulation of “a well-lit bridge” to Nato membership. The best he is willing to do is sweeten the pill with a 10-year bilateral defence pact that changes very little and, tellingly, is cancellable with six months’ notice.
We have seen Sweden and Finland become Nato members in the blink of an eye and with no need for any kind of a bridge. That won’t happen for Ukraine. With Putin’s battles raging, all of the member states know that they would effectively be at war with Russia from the moment of Ukrainian accession.
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And if it is unwilling to have Ukraine as a member for fear of being drawn into direct conflict with Russia, then how likely is it that American, French, German or British leaders will be willing to send their sons and daughters to fight and die for the sovereignty of Poland or the Baltic States, even though they are Nato members?
(Excerpt) Read more at yahoo.com ...
And the American people will not stand for a POTUS sending their young men to die for places they cannot find on a map, and where we otherwise have no real interests whatsoever.
And WOE unto the POTUS that tries to force it on 'em.
This has always been the case. That is why all the talk blaming NATO expansion for Russia's attack is so much BS.
That’s an interesting point.
Biden loves Ukraine and so do Democrats in general because it is a corruption machine.
I have lived abroad in several countries and worked all over the world including attempting to invest in Ukraine. Without exception it is the most corrupt place I have been among some 40 countries.
“Putin has drawn Nato into a trap”
There was only ONE AMERICAN who could beat the Russians in Chess, and sure enough, the Neocons drove him out of the country until he died in Iceland.
The idea that the IDIOTS in DC have ANY CLUE to how badly they’re outmatched by the Russians is pure dreaming, as they are TOTALLY CLUELESS and it shows on the Ukraine Battlefield, day after day.
Are there any Warsaw Pact nations in NATO?
A camel outside your tent wants a small favor.
“then how likely is it that American, French, German or British leaders will be willing to send their sons and daughters to fight and die for the sovereignty of Poland or the Baltic States, even though they are Nato members?”
I would say that depends on the BEHAVIOR of those countries. If they try getting too ‘cute’ with Russia, then I have no doubt that Trump and others will let them fend for themselves. And given what gets posted here by people from those countries, don’t be surprised if that exact scenario actually happens.
former Warsaw Pact members
Or maybe Putin saw it coming? It’s brinksmanship. At some point he had to draw a line, and maybe he also figured that Poland and Germany etc were off limits but the tiny Baltic states? We can bomb them with little risk to troops as Clinton proved. But would we really commit troops to defending Montenegro or North Macedonia or Croatia?
“This has always been the case. That is why all the talk blaming NATO expansion for Russia’s attack is so much BS.”
A complete non sequitur.
NATO’s expansion is CLEARLY and indisputably the reason Russia acted militarily in Ukraine. Only a dumb-ass could reason otherwise.
Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia (both together former Czechoslovakia), Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary. These were former Warsaw Pact countries. East Germany, another Warsaw Pact member, became part of Germany.
To add, Latvia Lithuania Estonia were parts of the USSR itself, and are now NATO.
“Yanukovich signed giving Russia a 60 year lease”
Doesn’t the Ukrainian Rada? have to ratify what would be a treaty?
Ok, Im a dumbass. Its been 20 years since the last Eastern Euro nation, anywhere near Russia, joined NATO. I doubt the Russians cared that Albania and Montenegro joined.
To add, NATO was moribund, spending trivial amounts on defense and letting their milutary establishments run down, which the pro-Russians here are glad to point out during other twists in this argument.
Its a Russian pretext for land-grabbing.
You can see Putin’s true thoughts on NATO as a threat by watching how he is leaving Russia largely unguarded on its borders while he moves everything to Ukraine, and his total lack of interest in Finland and Sweden joining and gaining another 830 miles of NATO borders.
The well known European saying :” When shaking hands with a Ukrainian, be sure to check how many fingers he stole”, rings truer everyday. American’s are just now starting understand?
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