Posted on 01/04/2024 7:23:22 PM PST by FarCenter
Rapidly evolving battlefield. Hopefully NATO is incorporating lessons being learned and applied in Ukraine to update our capability. The Russians most certainly are. One would think that all results, feedback and advancements are being shared with the Iranians.
The liberal gay stealth liberation war
Is coming up on the radar now
The veil - propaganda is shredding
Gog = marxist dems
Magog = nato gay supremacists
Rev 13
They’re being shared by the world - the video is out there for everyone to see.
Lessons learned should be ongoing, but I do not trust a corrupt and compromised Biden administration.
The question becomes, who does he sell us out to, in what order. Chinese, Iranian, Russian? It doesn't appear the Saudis are on the list, but who knows? The Ukrainians make the grade, but the Chinese seem to be benefiting the most. India?
They're simply too slow in this scenario and it reproduces most of the weaknesses of using armor in urban centers.
Now armored ground troops facing the same obstacles with an air force that can pound the crap out of the enemy on the ground, his C3 and his logistics for weeks and go through quickly to a position where they can regain speed and maneuver behind the enemy is a different story.
The main obstacle here is not technical: it's monetary. Bush and the West just assumed the era of heavy combat was over and we could continue to just fight with light infantry. LOL
Dive bombers made battleships a liability in WWIi.
The Russian tandems weigh something like 50 pounds or more. Not exactly very mobile.
If you have proper combined arms with enough air power and artillery, infantry is still very vulnerable.
Western military circles are filled with an air of unreality because they've never had to fight with heavy forces since WWII. They got used to the illusion that just smart bombs and light infantry and almost no casualties were the norm.
Our biggest deficit is not equipment (although that is a problem): it's no strategic depth in trained manpower. Like the British Army in WWI, a few months of heavy ground combat would eat up most of our ground forces.
Tanks are vulnerable to modern weapons but so is everything and everyone else.
In order to survive, a military force needs a very well coordinated combined arms force employing a very sophisticated and secure real time ISR capability
Not even stealth aircraft can survive unless they are well supported and protected.
The Ukrainians have some of the components of these systems and they can do a lot of damage but they are operated by unskilled soldiers who do knot understand how to use them properly, they are isolated and lack the mutual support of the other key components so they get attacked and destroyed in detail.
That’s the heavy ATGM versions. There’s several RPG-7-compatible versions, one of which Hamas has been making extensive use of in Gaza.
Here’s the Russian export version:
http://roe.ru/eng/catalog/land-forces/strelkovoe-oruzhie/grenade-launchers/pg-7vr/
That doesn’t weigh any 50 pounds and for its size, it’s got a pretty terrifying anti-armor capability.
There’s the -R version, which has put in an appearance in Ukraine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OCrg6Xm_hU
Fortunately, the Israelis have Trophy APC on all their Merkavas and the majority of their Namer APCs and Hamas hasn’t been having a lot of luck against those.
Here’s a discussion about the tandem warhead variant used by Hamas, courtesy of Iran (it’s different than the Russian one):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e_eOBLw0Wg
There was a video on TWTR which showed Hamas climbing out of a spider hole and attaching a mine to a tank turret. Jumped back into the hole so explosion heard but not filmed.
Maybe they need to bring back Zimmerit.
Zimmerit doesn’t work against modern adhesives and it didn’t even work all that well against ‘sticky bombs’ in WW2.
I saw that video - Hamas also, for *some* reason, wasn’t able to show the ostensibly destroyed tank afterwards... They do a lot of creative editing.
Could be. I wasn’t 100% that it was legit.
No cage, and no reactive amor on that vehicle.
Does a cage and reactive armor combination disrupt a two stage shaped charge ?
A cage can possibly do something about it by keeping the warhead’s focused plasma jet away from the armor so it is diffused to the point where it can’t get into the armor. However, it is mostly effective only against single shaped charge warheads; with a tandem warhead it is marginal at best as the primary charge tends to clear the slat/cage armor and the second charge jets into the armor.
Explosive reactive armor will do nothing - tandem warheads were designed specifically to punch through ERA *and* the armor underneath.
On top of all that, many of the smaller tandem charge warheads are designed to punch through slat armor instead od detonating on it. Other people were paying attention; slat or standoff armor is a traditional answer to shaped charges since WW2, after all.
In addition, some re-imagine the tank as consisting of an especially well protected manned vehicle that is camouflaged and hides as it controls a number of unmanned weapons and recon vehicles that are also armored and do battle semi-autonomously.
As for the battleship analogy, it should be kept in mind that the USN still has some exceptionally well-armored ships -- aircraft carriers. They also have highly capable defensive systems and sail with other warships clustered about to defend them. In broad terms, this may be where tanks are heading, armored, highly capable, and highly protected.
Guess they need to field a few BOLO Mk XXX Planetary Assault Units; the improved hyper-heuristic battle decision capabilities along with the incorporation of counter-grav into it’s suspension and powertrain really improved it’s battlefield performance and survivability.
Tank meets Hellfire missile fire from an AH Apache helicopter about four or five miles out.
No more tank.
Israeli tanks have ‘’cope cages’’.
Those things did absolutely nothing for the Russkies.
Actually, they have. They did nothing against top down attack missiles, but properly constructed ones protect from grenades/explosives dropped by drones or off rooftops. Nobody with a clue is laughing at them any more.
Unless you’re running around buttoned up with hatches closed, this is what now happens without a cope cage:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3K_1Gt1f8M
And the Javelin makes a cope cage useless.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.