Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: GenXPolymath

I don’t think it needs to be stored at all, but shipped out and re-used. Also, we know have the know-how to reduce nuclear storage to almost nothing. The new nuclear plants that are coming online are capable of recycling nuclear waste until it is nearly inert or inert. Nuclear storage is now potentially a thing of the past, or at least much reduced.


15 posted on 01/04/2024 7:41:56 PM PST by Jonty30 (In a nuclear holocaust, there is always a point in time where the meat is cooked to perfection. )
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies ]


To: Jonty30

Agreed, CO2 is a valuable industrial chemical. My point was that humans have all the tech we need to store it underground indefinitely if we needed too. We don’t we should use any bulk captured CO2 to make polymers (plastics,glues,resins), carbon based chemicals,synthetic liquid/gaseous fuels, enhanced oil recovery, enhanced greenhouse plant growth...Ect.

Science has already figured out how to turn CO2 directly into food(sugars,acetic as well using nothing but CO2 electricity and water.

Acetic acid is not only industrial a keychemical it’s also the primary energy source in a cow’s gut tract you can feed acetic acid directly to cattle in pellet form. The whole fermentation process of the cow’s four chamber stomach is for it’s symbiotic bacterial colonies to turn cellulose into acetic acid one of the three key fatty acids that literally power the cow.

Acetic acid corresponding base molecule also can be made directly from CO2. You can grow in vats huge quantities of high quality nutritionally complete protein read animal feed for monogastrics(chickens,pigs,fish,shellfish) even humans think protein bars or powder for body builders or elderly ensure type drinks. You also can grow plants directly on a hydroponic feed of acetate in the dark the plants will use the chemical energy in the acetate for growth rather than photosynthesis. This allows massive stack and pack warehouse style plant growth no sunlight needed. Think space travel food sources.

CO2 plus electricity equals an myriad of products CO2 is to valuable to bury it underground indefinitely. That electricity can come from nuclear power <<< this is the way with fast reactors and virtually zero wastes. Or if you foolishly built out massive over capacity with wind and solar instead of curtailing the production when the grid cannot handle the electricity you dump it into electosynthesis of chemicals that then can be used industrially.

I’m a huge fan of the integral fast reactor that Jimmy Fing Carter shut down for communist reasons. That IFR recycled every bit of it’s spent fuel except for it’s.fission products that were turned into glass and could be stored down deep bore holes for a few thousand years not millions before it decayed to safe levels.

Even without IRF tech the modern once through fuel cycles waste stream is still so dense deep bore holes make economical sense. It is hugely wasteful to dump 96% perfectly good fuel down a borehole because Jimmy Carter killed our reprocessing program. To put it into perspective the LIFETIME electricity consumption of the average American if powered solely by once through nuclear power waste volume would fit into a 12 ounce soup can. It works out to about 34 grams per year of spent fuel wastes. At 10 grams per cubic cm density 77 years fits into ~300cm^3 or 10 US ounces of volume. <<< read this again and then think about how much ash waste a coal plant makes per kWh per year for an annual 12,000kWh over 77 years. Then think about if we had fast reactors that waste volume would be 6% of a 12 ounce coke can for the lifetime electricity consumption of the average American that alone should mean nuclear power is the future for any long term industrialized society.

As always a slew of reference materials to support the above statements.

https://news.northwestern.edu/stories/2023/05/catalyst-transforms-carbon-dioxide/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0021925818517518/pdf

https://www.nasa.gov/centers-and-facilities/marshall/nasa-awards-750000-in-competition-to-convert-carbon-dioxide-into-sugar/

https://global.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202308/24/WS64e697a9a31035260b81de21.html

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2542435122004081

https://netl.doe.gov/node/12678

https://novonordiskfonden.dk/en/news/co2-as-a-sustainable-raw-material-in-our-future-food-production/

https://whatisnuclear.com/calcs/how-much-nuclear-waste-per-capita.html


17 posted on 01/05/2024 3:43:16 PM PST by GenXPolymath
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies ]

To: Jonty30

Just for grins I looked up how much ash a coal plant puts out on average per megawatt hour...

“Coal ash is the solid byproduct left over after coal is burned. Every megawatt hour generated in a coal plant leaves behind 185 pounds of ash.”

The average American uses 12,000kWh per year in electricity that’s 2,220lbs per year or 170,940lbs over a 77 year lifetime. Compare that to 2.281kg = 5.02lbs of spent fuel which is still 96% useable fuel. 170,940lbs vs 5 the choice for a modern civilization could not be more clear. Remember coal ash is chemically toxic, full of heavy metals including radioactive uranium and thorium so.much so that the coal plant releases 10,000 times more radiation into the environment via it’s ash and stack gasses than a nuclear power plant does on a megawatt to megawatt basis. It should be a crime against humanity to burn coal in the open air while denying nuclear power building permits.

Coal ash must also be entombed for all of eternity it’s chemical toxicity never wanes and it’s radioactivity is all long lived heavy metal isotopes with very long half life’s but they are gamma emitters so once inside the body they bioaccumulate and keep emitting gamma rays damaging DNA for the life of the person.

Coal should be put in the dust bin of history at least for open air burn to the sky uses. Underground coal gasification is a entirely different animal and keeps the ash,toxic metals and radioactive metals right where they belong thousands of feet underground while allowing the extraction of 85% of the coals energy. Bonus of UCG is only 1/6 of the world’s coals are mineable UCG opens up six times more resources. These include Coal to deep to mine, offshore coals on the continental shelf, thin seam coals, steeply inclined bed coals the number is staggering over ten trillion metric tonnes worth. Other than methane hydrates which dwarfs all other hydrocarbons coal is second oil is far far behind both. Thousands of years worth of each where as light crude oils have 47 years left at 2021 consumption levels. We need nuclear with fast reactors and UCG plus Arctic/offshore methane hydrates post haste.

https://www.freeingenergy.com/environmental-impact-coal-water-co2-so2-mercury-pollution/


18 posted on 01/05/2024 10:27:59 PM PST by GenXPolymath
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson