Nato may be about to sell Ukraine short – and make itself irrelevant

The Telegraph via Yahoo ^ | August 19th, 2023 | Colonel Richard Kemp

[cowboyusa]

ToomStone.

[lodi90]

That is a feature and not a bug of Biden-Obama admin foreign policy. Democrats have never stopped partnering with Putin on Iran. WEF EU wants Russian energy and not American energy. Biden doesn’t want American energy and the good jobs that come with it, either. In the end those folks care about Ukrainians exactly as much as they do Americans. That would be not at all. Putin is an ally in their Anti American agenda and that is all that matters.

[MarMema]

Sniff. We knew this was coming.

Here is some tissue for all the zelensky/Biden lovers..

[lodi90]

Let the Euros deal with this. It’s their problem — not ours.

---

Let NATO Europe get their energy from Russia. Let Russia use those resources to build nuclear weapons to point at us. No need for those good American energy jobs, anyway. Let Ukrainians live as slaves, again, in the filthy Russian World....

[MarMema]

What is it?

[Right_Wing_Madman]

Ukraine was ALWAYS short...what’s happening now is that NATO is dealing with the reality of also being ‘short’.

What sunk NATO was Europe's refusal to contribute to its own defense. The world is figuring out that Europe simply doesn't have the military capacity to back up all the pomp and rhetoric. Stalin famously asked, "How many divisions does the Pope have?" That same question is being asked of the EU.

If Russia launched a full-out invasion of Europe, the mighty Great Britain cannot even provide one division (including reserves) for that defense. Ireland's total active duty force (army, navy, and air force) is less than 8,000 people. Austria's military budget is less than 1 percent of its GDP. The paltry numbers go on and on across the continent.

[MarMema]

Ok.

[buwaya]

“The borders in Europe moved back and forth for a thousand years”

And then the nature of war changed. Modernity made wars vastly more extensive and devastating. Hence the 20th century imperative to prevent wars between the powers.

Or earlier really. The 30 years war led to the Peace of Westphalia, out of the sheer dread of something like that happening again.

And it held, pretty well, through 150 years of limited wars. Until Napoleon. And the reaction to that held for another 100 years.

And on to today. We are in another age of peace, or fairly nondisruptive limited wars.

[Robert DeLong]

One major item that Ukraine can not easily resupply, is able-bodied Ukrainian men of fighting age. NATO should have recognized that fact before they started this proxy war in the first place, or allowed Joe Biden's administration to convince them into their participation in the ill-conceived proxy war.

One reason the American & EU public is now turning away from supporting the Ukraine conflict is the realization that the young men who will be forced into providing young combat ready men, will be those within their own borders.

If they want to continue, then take their once welcomed, but now despised invaders into their homelands and send them to fight on Ukraine's front lines.

[lodi90]

That Democrats still want to partner with Kremlin should no surprise at all since they’ve been doing it for a century.

NATO is doing just fine under new leadership, btw:

Korean made K2 tanks and K9 self-propelled howitzers as far as the eye can see in Poland. I remind you that the contract was signed less than a year ago.

https://twitter.com/mr_mogensen/status/1692417021022027854

[BobL]

“What sunk NATO was Europe’s refusal to contribute to its own defense.”

The working theory is that NATO thought their ‘sanctions’ would take down Russia, as even NATO knew that they couldn’t hold a candle to Russia’s military.

Of course the problem for NATO was that Russia knew what was coming, and was ready for it.

[Lockbox]

Do we get our money back? Who pays, Ukraine, NATO, both?

[dynachrome]

“Tombstone’

Val Kilmer deserved an oscar for his role as Doc Holiday.

[alternatives?]

“That Democrats still want to partner with Kremlin “

I believe the correct way to say this is “The establishment wants Russia to be a part of the NWO.

[AAABEST]

The answer to this apparent stalemate is not to pressure Ukraine into conceding Russian annexation of its land, but to change the facts on the ground. That can only be done by redoubling efforts to supply Kyiv with sufficient combat resources to drive Russia out, if not this year then next.

True to the neocon groupthink, let's double down on our vapid stupidity and failure. Throw more money and stomp around harder - that'll do it. $100 billion was too little.

These people haven't won anything since WWII yet - like dogs to vomit - here we are again.

They will literally sacrifice us at the altar of neocon fail.

[lodi90]

The establishment wants to destroy our American Heritage and Putin being a born and bred KGB Bolshevik is only too happy to help in any way he can.

[alternatives?]

“The establishment wants to destroy our American Heritage and Putin being a born and bred KGB Bolshevik is only too happy to help in any way he can.”

???? The establishment wins if Russia loses.

[ransomnote]

In the News/Activism forum, on a thread titled Nato may be about to sell Ukraine short – and make itself irrelevant, lodi90 wrote:

That is a feature and not a bug of Biden-Obama admin foreign policy. Democrats have never stopped partnering with Putin on Iran. WEF EU wants Russian energy and not American energy. Biden doesn’t want American energy and the good jobs that come with it, either. In the end those folks care about Ukrainians exactly as much as they do Americans. That would be not at all. Putin is an ally in their Anti American agenda and that is all that matters.

Russia has been disobedient to the WEF EU so they want to force regime change using a proxy war with Ukraine. Putin is for Russia First, no one's ally. That's fine if/when we have Trump for America First. But Biden is for our enemies FIRST.

[Da Coyote]

Perhaps Biden should return the millions he got from the Ukraine for graft, corruption, and his son’s life of drugs and Hos.

[Trump20162020]

"The answer to this apparent stalemate is not to pressure Ukraine into conceding Russian annexation of its land, but to change the facts on the ground. That can only be done by redoubling efforts to supply Kyiv with sufficient combat resources to drive Russia out, if not this year then next."

This author is awfully willing to have other people die to sate his lust for Russia's defeat. How many more Ukrainians must die for this goal?