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U.S. Leans Toward Providing Abrams Tanks to Ukraine
WSJ ^ | 24-JAN-2023 | Michael R. Gordon

Posted on 01/24/2023 7:32:40 AM PST by SpeedyInTexas

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To: jneesy
...M1’s aren’t being produced anymore...

That statement is simply not true.

The M1A2C is currently in production.

The Army plans to retire all M1A1SAs by 2025. These would be ideal to send to Ukraine.

The Nationalinterest.org article explains it all.

Here's an article: US Army 3rd Brigade Combat Team Receives New M1A2C Main Battle Tank .

81 posted on 01/24/2023 10:55:40 AM PST by FtrPilot
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To: Psalm 73; Zhang Fei
Psalm 73 wrote:
"M1 Abrams are unlike any other main battle tank in the world - maintenance and logistics would be a bear for the Ukes.

Unless American maintenance and logistics personnel are provided....
"

Many of the men in the Ukrainian forces have proven that they can learn quickly and follow through. The key is that they are eager to join our western culture in general. They don't need U.S. fighting men on Ukrainian soil to do it. We've trained them outside of Ukraine, and they've done very well since then (public news).

In sum, they want to go on to improve their civilian lives with their hard work and merits without gangsters getting in their way. Their military training in western countries will go a long way to support their new lives after the war.

82 posted on 01/24/2023 11:55:21 AM PST by familyop ("For they that sleep with dogs, shall rise with fleas" (John Webster, "The White Devil" 1612).)
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To: SpeedyInTexas

There’s a new tank being built for the U.S. Army. The old M1 will be fine for the Ukrainian forces, and there’s plenty of support in the countries of nearby neighbors. There’s no need for U.S. soldiers in Ukraine. Ukrainian soldiers are doing just fine and are highly motivated to learn.


83 posted on 01/24/2023 12:43:54 PM PST by familyop ("For they that sleep with dogs, shall rise with fleas" (John Webster, "The White Devil" 1612).)
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To: Right_Wing_Madman

“I’ll restate the obvious: these endless transfers of US/NATO equipment wouldn’t be necessary if Ukraine was winning.”

Obvious nonsense. If your car is moving forward does that mean it never needs to be refueled?


84 posted on 01/24/2023 2:11:21 PM PST by Renfrew (Muscovia delenda est)
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To: SpeedyInTexas

Whatever equipment we give the Ukraine we will not get back and the equipment will end up in the Russian and Chinese arsenals.


85 posted on 01/24/2023 2:29:39 PM PST by Captain Compassion (I'm just sayin')
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To: exPBRrat

Zalinsky is a dictator. He looked down the Russian Orthodox Church. He may be a more despicable character than Putin.


86 posted on 01/24/2023 2:47:33 PM PST by Machavelli (True God)
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To: SpeedyInTexas

At some point Putin is going to escalate this to a level no one wants...NukeS.
Our upping the supply of more sophisticated weapons to Ukraine is moving us closer to it.
Then What???


87 posted on 01/24/2023 3:49:22 PM PST by Vinnie ( L g Brandon)
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To: Vinnie

“Then What???”

Little Pukin dies.


88 posted on 01/24/2023 6:45:35 PM PST by SpeedyInTexas (RuZZia is the enemy of all mankind)
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To: PIF

M1A1’s weight is probably not “too high” for primary roads & bridges in Ukraine, and really not hugely higher than the Leopards (depending a bit on which Leopard variant.) M1A2’s weight otoh IS problematic, but SFAIK no one is talking about sending A2’s. Still, the best bet might be to use the M1’s primarily as a deterrent against Russia attacking Kyiv, with the now “freed up” Leopards out in the fields, so to speak, in the east and south. That helps with maintenance and fuel consumption. Ukraine’s air defenses are probably good enough at this point to keep Russian aircraft at bay (current situation) unless Pooty decides considerable aircraft losses are acceptable. Long range missiles are not much good vs. tanks, but drones can be a problem (for both sides).


89 posted on 01/24/2023 9:35:10 PM PST by Paul R. (You know your pullets are dumb if they don't recognize a half Whopper as food!)
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To: srmanuel

You know more than you think you do! Combined arms training in the US Army at the Battalion/Brigade level takes years of both field and classroom education. By the time an officer commands a battalion he usually has 15-20 years’ service. If they are training to just be ‘good enough’ to rolll out of the laager and come online long enough to plink a few Russian targets, it can be done more quickly by cutting corners.

Also, the tanks we might ‘loan’ them will almost certainly be ‘monkey models’ minus most of the sophisticated stuff, therefore easier to train. We’ve been down this road before training the Iraqi Army on the Abrams, and I’m sure we learned all the lessons we need to train these non-English speaking 3rd worlders just as well as the Iraqi’s (sarcasm alert).

Your assessment of logistics are also spot on. Military Classes of supply are very different from country to country. The only similarity may be the main gun ammo: standard NATO 120mm rounds should fit any NATO tank.

You were pretty close on the roles of the Americans on the battlefield. They won’t (by and large) be soldiers, rather, an army of contractors will maintain/repair and service the beasties. Some fun facts about the Abrams: Fuel Capacity: 503 gallons. It burns 5 gallons just to hit the starter. MPG: 0.6. Type of fuel: Generally JP-4 (mostly kerosene), but it is supposed to be a ‘multi-fuel’ engine so you can run diesel or regular gasoline, but all the fuel filters will have to be replaced each time they switch. Planning figures: 60 gallons per hour in the field and will need approximately 300 gal of fuel every eight hours. That’s just one tank. A US tank company consists of 14 tanks (and a bunch of other thirsty support vehicles).

The Leo and Chally units will face similar issues. If this happens, my faith in the senior leadership of the army will be completely crushed. They have to know this is a bad idea, (for many reasons) but no one will fall on their sword. And if they don’t know, then they don’t deserve to be in a position to risk American soldiers in a war that isn’t ours.

(Rant off) Cheers!


90 posted on 01/24/2023 9:51:04 PM PST by Thunder 6
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To: SpeedyInTexas

From supposition to fact in one day.

Proving gooberments can screw up at the speed of light and never get around to doing the right thing.


91 posted on 01/24/2023 9:53:08 PM PST by Sequoyah101 (Procrastination is just a form of defiance.)
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To: PGR88

I am sending back your text with a slight change of a couple of words or so :

‘’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’

“Russia will suffer at least 5 million dead before this is over. 3-5% of a total population killed is kind of a statistical minimum before a country completely loses the will and ability to fight.

Russia is governed by Soviet ideologues who are the sorts that would rather see everyone dead before they surrender.

The USA is prepared to give Ukraine money and weapons to bleed Russia out of its last Wagner convicts.

Russia is prepared to make it happen.”


92 posted on 01/24/2023 9:53:28 PM PST by USA-FRANCE
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To: JewishRighter

“I think he’s speaking in code to create pressure for the US to send Abrams M1A1’s which (fortunately) our government has felt (so far) that its advanced technology should not be shared with anyone in that part of the world. Linda is so fired up in his panties about Ukraine beating the Russians, I’m sure he has no problem giving away the store.”
****************************************************************************

I think you have the flaccid Volcel Linda figured out. I, for one, would love to have that lifelong REMF involuntarily transported and placed in the forward trenches on the most active Ukraine front.


93 posted on 01/24/2023 10:10:30 PM PST by House Atreides (I’m now ULTRA-MAGA. -PRO-MAX)
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To: House Atreides

Thanks. REMF? Should I even ask?


94 posted on 01/25/2023 8:17:56 AM PST by JewishRighter
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To: srmanuel

Zelensky, that grifting little weasel will sell the things to the highest bidder so his wife can go to Paris on a shopping spree.


95 posted on 01/25/2023 9:48:48 AM PST by jmacusa (Liberals. Too stupid to be idiots. )
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To: Right_Wing_Madman

Cogent

They don’t care

Damn the torpedoes or “geranium drones”


96 posted on 01/26/2023 9:07:03 PM PST by wardaddy (Truth is treason in the Empire of liars)
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