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To: volunbeer
I guess I'd put it this way. I think the globalists do not want Putin to win. I also believe they wish he'd never started the war in this first place, would withdraw, and the war would end.

This war is shining a light on the issues of nationalism, and national self-interest, which is exactly where the globalists do not want a spotlight to shine. After all, they were the ones pushing NordStream and European reliance on Russian gas so heavily. Now...that's a dead issue.

I don't think there are any winners in this war, but as of now, both sides view a loss as unacceptable to the continuation of the war. Just speaking historically, I would expect that it will be the Russians who eventually back down because they still keep their own country even with a loss. The Ukrainians do not, so they'll fight until the end.

182 posted on 10/12/2022 11:11:45 AM PDT by Bruce Campbells Chin
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To: Bruce Campbells Chin

I am pretty much where you landed too.

There is another realistic option that few talk about that would end this conflict and that is if the Russian military or one of his oligarch friends upended Putin.

All the arguing and sniping aside and its sure to come, consider that the oligarch inner circle is not pleased with how this war is going and IF they believe there is a real possibility of a 1) loss or 2) an uprising of the people they are toast too. The next leader will almost certainly clear out the Putinista’s and tell the people he is returning the “wealth” to them. One way to mitigate this would be for the oligarch(s) to take out Putin - it could be the only way they get to keep a portion of their wealth that remains in Russia.

The same thing is true for the military leadership inside Russia. They are being blamed by Putin and sacked (or worse given Russian history) already and there is certainly more to come. We are already seeing rumors that they blame Putin for their failure (this always happens) and Putin just moved new forces to protect himself. History shows this is the most common means of removal of a “dictator” and this allows the generals to save some face (blame Putin) AND keep their ill-gotten wealth that they siphoned off from the defense budget - a reason their lives are in danger.

The new “leaders” could basically blame Putin and call for a reset to consolidate their own power and possibly win some favor from the west turning on the oil spigot again to Europe thereby enriching themselves with more crumbs for the people.

Maybe this is fanciful thinking, but history shows either scenario is possible and this might be especially true in Russia where the military and FSB have always had a lot of power. The inner circle of Putin are mired in corruption and they have to be looking over their shoulder, worrying about how this ends, questioning Putin’s sanity and health, and wondering what their place might look like in the next regime or if they will become a populist target.

What happens to them when “President for Life” shifts off this mortal coil? Does their ally or enemy take over? Almost all of them are exposed because the new leader will clean out the old (and grab the money) and their enemies to solidify their own power base. They might be wealthy, but that wealth does not buy guarantees (especially in Russia) and you can only carry so much in a briefcase.

There is a big chance they quickly become a zero so maybe one or some of them go for hero.

At this point, looking at my own interest and those of my nation, we would be better off without Putin. Without him, this war ends. I have no trust or misconceptions about Zelensky either, but at least he does not have hundreds or thousands of nuclear weapons aimed towards us.

This would be best for the Ukrainian and Russian people as well as both are suffering with little voice or say in what is happening.


195 posted on 10/12/2022 11:56:12 AM PDT by volunbeer (Find the truth and accept it - anything else is delusional)
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