You’re not too bright are you? None of what you say has any relevance to the West or the USA. Ukraine is an existential struggle yes - but that’s completely unimportant to anyone but themselves.
***We had enough interest to give assurances for their borders and sovereignty in 1994. They even gave up nukes for those guarantees but guys like you wanna sell them down the river. Since the original nuke agreement is null and void, that means they can pursue nukes, with their nukular knowledge and access to fissionable materials and with them being in [what you acknowledge] is an existential threat to their existence. Their capability to go nuclear is the total opposite of “completely unimportant to anyone but themselves. “
We have no interest or beef in it.
***We had enough interest and beef in it to give assurances in that agreement.
That’s the point. Why are you so passionate about it ?
***Because people like you are so stupid and can’t see the direct path to nuclear war you are generating by your pantywaist pacifism, just like what happened in 1938 appeasement of Hitler.
Secondly, the fact that we shouldn’t be fighting Russia
***That is not a fact. It is simply an assertion. You guys can’t tell your facts from your own bloviated assertions.
doesn’t make anyone an “apologist for Putin.”
***Sure it does. It props up his approach and desires.
No one is apologizing or justifying his actions.
***You haven’t been reading FR lately. Plenty of Putinist apologising and justifying goin’ on.
We don’t like them- but that doesn’t follow we should fight them.
***We gave them assurances of sovereignty and borders in 1994. That means we shoudl fight against their invader, or at least give the most aggressive of assistance up to and including nuclear, since they gave up their nukes and this wouldn’t be happening if they had kept their nukes.
Just saying we shouldn’t be fighting Russia.
***There’s plenty of Putin apologizing goin’ on.
Nuclear powers don’t fight directly, old Cold War rule.
***Then Russia should never have invaded Ukraine. The Budapest Agreement was in place.
Things have a way of escalating and there goes the end of MAD.
***Then Russia should not have invaded Ukraine. Gigantic duhh factor.
Putie nukies could ruin your whole day.
***And Putie nukies could be coming your way due to your aggressive appeasement generating the nuke solution for the Ukes. It is ONLY happening because of Putinist pukes like you.
And lead to complete extermination of the Ukrainians you love so much for no apparent reason.
***They’re in an existential struggle right now. You’d start talking differently if the Ukes turned it into an existential struggle for Russia with just 2 nukes.
You realize you’re leading them down the path of mass death right?
***I’m saying that to YOU.
Every single point you make is demonstrably false, complete non sequiturs. You might want to look that term up, maybe read a primer on logic.
Assurances on sovereignty mean nothing. It proves nothing. It doesn’t mean that Ukraine is important. It’s meaningless. It’s just political doublespeak which was used to help the disintegration of the Soviet Union.
They never “gave up nukes” - a very prevalent myth. They had them on their territory, but couldn’t use them - launch codes and control were exclusively with Russia, at all times. Ukraine never, ever had nuclear weapons it could use. They have no capability to go nuclear and never did. And even if they had then - which they didn’t- they sure don’t now, so it’s irrelevant. They have no nuclear material or capability. Also, learn to spell nuclear.
Ukraine is of no real importance to the West. Assurances be damned. Did the West prevent the invasion or enter the war? So what assurances then!? Meaningless hot air.
Pacifism doesn’t lead to nuclear war. Please provide a single such example. Nor am I a pacifist. Had Russia been non nuclear Id be all for war. I’d also be for an immediate attack on China if they weren’t a nuclear power. Your Hitler analogy is tired and predictable. This isn’t anything like the 1930s lead up with Germany, learn some history.
It is a FACT that we shouldn’t be fighting Russia, the greatest nuclear power on Earth. All knowledgeable authorities agree. Even Biden agrees. Are you stupider than an old man in a diaper? You sure sound it. NATO has said it. The US and Canada say it. Germany and Britain say it. Even Poland has said it. You know better than all the leading authorities of the leading NATO governments and militaries? Grow up.
I think you misread the arguments against war. It’s not love of Putin. It’s realpolitik based on our interests. Also we NEVER gave Ukraine assurances we would fight alongside them. Provide proof of such an agreement or shut up. We have no military alliance with Ukraine.
Repeat nuclear powers don’t fight directlly. Even if Putin invaded Ukraine. Heck we wouldn’t even fight to protect Finland or Sweden I would guess. There is no nuclear Ukrainian solution. They will NEVER have nukes. Get over it. Never. The invasion of Ukraine is a complex matter based on expansion of NATO and a weak US administration.
There is no existential struggle here except for Ukraine. Not for us. For THEM. They are not us. Comprende? By encouraging this war to continue you are going the Ukies slaughtered. Is that your goal?