Posted on 12/20/2020 3:23:53 PM PST by MNDude
Citing the United States Constitution and U.S. Code, Constitutional Lawyer Ivan Raiklin says it is Vice President Mike Pence’s duty to instruct states to expeditiously send their Electoral College Certificates immediately if they have not been received. U.S.C. 12 explains that “When no certificate of vote and list mentioned in sections 9 and 11 of this title from any State shall have been received by the President of the Senate or by the Archivist of the United States by the fourth Wednesday in December, after the meeting of the electors shall have been held, the President of the Senate … shall request, by the most expeditious method available, the secretary of state of the State to send up the certificate…”
Beyond the allegations and evidence of widespread fraud presented by both President Donald Trump’s legal team and independent lawyers and witnesses across the United States, several states have now sent competing slates of delegates to Washington, D.C.
(Excerpt) Read more at nationalfile.com ...
The first one won't make a difference and the second has virtually no chance since the votes to uphold the challenge aren't there in either the House or the Senate.
I can't find any requirement in the ECA of 1887 or in the Constitution that requires the VP to count any vote, fraudulent or otherwise...
3 U.S. Code § 15 - Counting electoral votes in Congress: Two tellers shall be previously appointed on the part of the Senate and two on the part of the House of Representatives, to whom shall be handed, as they are opened by the President of the Senate, all the certificates and papers purporting to be certificates of the electoral votes, which certificates and papers shall be opened, presented, and acted upon in the alphabetical order of the States, beginning with the letter A...
It appears the VP opens all the certificates and passes them on to the tellers; and after the tellers receive the slates, the following occurs:
......and said tellers, having then read the same in the presence and hearing of the two Houses, shall make a list of the votes as they shall appear from the said certificates; and the votes having been ascertained and counted according to the rules in this subchapter provided, the result of the same shall be delivered to the President of the Senate, who shall thereupon announce the state of the vote,... the President of the Senate shall call for objections, if any.
And this is when the fun begins...
Each congressional delegation gets one vote for their state. The GOP has 30.
If neither party has 270 then it goes to congress.... and Trump wins.
ROTFLMBO..Damn, I wish I had thought of that!
I hate to rain on the parade, but the laws on this are pretty clear. If a state has certified its votes using whatever methodology the state legislature set up for that purpose prior to the election, then those votes are considered the valid votes by the law. As much as I’d like to see another term of Trump, it’s not going to come by Pence just chucking the certified votes and deciding to count the others instead.
Many of the stages ignored their own election laws.
And certified the votes anyway.
By default theres an inherently major problem with them doing that.
You know it and i know it and every attorney worth anything knows that. And every judge worth it knows it.
It’s not going to work that way. This makes the process fairly clear (as muddled as this sounds).
From 3 U.S. Code § 15 - Counting electoral votes in Congress
If more than one return or paper purporting to be a return from a State shall have been received by the President of the Senate, those votes, and those only, shall be counted which shall have been regularly given by the electors who are shown by the determination mentioned in section 5 of this title to have been appointed, if the determination in said section provided for shall have been made, or by such successors or substitutes, in case of a vacancy in the board of electors so ascertained, as have been appointed to fill such vacancy in the mode provided by the laws of the State; but in case there shall arise the question which of two or more of such State authorities determining what electors have been appointed, as mentioned in section 5 of this title, is the lawful tribunal of such State, the votes regularly given of those electors, and those only, of such State shall be counted whose title as electors the two Houses, acting separately, shall concurrently decide is supported by the decision of such State so authorized by its law; and in such case of more than one return or paper purporting to be a return from a State, if there shall have been no such determination of the question in the State aforesaid, then those votes, and those only, shall be counted which the two Houses shall concurrently decide were cast by lawful electors appointed in accordance with the laws of the State, unless the two Houses, acting separately, shall concurrently decide such votes not to be the lawful votes of the legally appointed electors of such State. But if the two Houses shall disagree in respect of the counting of such votes, then, and in that case, the votes of the electors whose appointment shall have been certified by the executive of the State, under the seal thereof, shall be counted.
That section 5 of this title they refer to a couple of times reads as follows:
If any State shall have provided, by laws enacted prior to the day fixed for the appointment of the electors, for its final determination of any controversy or contest concerning the appointment of all or any of the electors of such State, by judicial or other methods or procedures, and such determination shall have been made at least six days before the time fixed for the meeting of the electors, such determination made pursuant to such law so existing on said day, and made at least six days prior to said time of meeting of the electors, shall be conclusive, and shall govern in the counting of the electoral votes as provided in the Constitution, and as hereinafter regulated, so far as the ascertainment of the electors appointed by such State is concerned.
Read my post 90 and you’ll see that it doesn’t matter. The votes that are certified by the state’s executive are counted if the “State shall have provided, by laws enacted prior to the day fixed for the appointment of the electors, for its final determination of any controversy or contest concerning the appointment of all or any of the electors of such State, by judicial or other methods or procedures, and such determination shall have been made at least six days before the time fixed for the meeting of the electors”
Notice it includes “by judicial or other methods or procedures.” That means that after any election contests are brought, if they are shot down by the judicial branch in that state, and certified by the executive, they are the votes that count.
The constitution doesnt exist to enable vote fraud.
I believe and i bet you as well do, that any attempt by atates to pass fraudulent election votes, by deliverately ignoring fraud and probably orchestrating it as well,
They have no right to rig the system just because they go ahead and certify the fraud. Thats totally opposed to what the constitution stands for.
Otherwise this devolves into any state can cheat and validate their cheating and fedgov must accept it. I doubt the Founders would go for that one.
“Flipping six House seats or adding more Senate seats”
These people crack me up. There aren’t ten votes in the Senate or 50 votes in the House to sustain Trump.
The elected Republicans are happier that he lost than the Democrats are. THEIR troubles are just beginning.
Its not up to Biden’s team to prove the votes are legal.
We disagree, and that’s okay
It was up to Trump’s team to prove they were not.
Team Trump has proven more than enough illegal votes to award the Electoral colledge votes to President Trump
They failed.
No, the Courts refused to hear the cases.
Pence must count the votes that were certified and sent by the states, he has no other option.
No, Pence is charged to count LEGAL votes.
If the States send up votes NOT CAST ACCORDING TO STATE LAW, then Pence, by Law, must not tally those illegal votes.
Let’s see what happens!
I know this was posted as satire at Twitter, but after all of the shenanigans this year. If I were VP Pence, I would be awfully tempted.
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Witnesses should be 60 feet away while Pence counts the Electoral College votes. They should have Plexiglas barriers between them and Pence as he counts.
Because COVID.
Pence should open all the envelops and then stack all the EC ballots in a pile. He should then shred all the envelopes and then burn the shreds. The pile of ballots shall then be shuffled.
Because COVID.
Pence should count a portion of votes and then call a lid on counting, while Joe Biden is in the lead. The witnesses should be escorted out, while being told no more counting will occur, promise!
Because COVID.
After a period of time, the witnesses should be allowed to return, but the Plexiglas windows should be covered with cardboard. They’ll be in the building, so still perfectly legal. They don’t need to actually be able to SEE Pence as he counts.
Because COVID.
Pence will continue counting. The remainder of the count will go 98% for Trump.
Because...yeah you get it by now.
At the end of the count, Pence shreds the ballots and burns the shreds. Trump wins the Electoral College.
Blah blah COVID.
Most secure Electoral College count in history.
Because COVID.
7 states have sent competing slates of electors.
7 states have sent competing slates of electors.
Yes. If one member of the House and one member of the Senate sign on to the challenge, and Goetz in the House and Tuberville in the Senate have both said they will, the it goes to both chambers for debate and vote. If it fails in either chamber then the challenge dies. All a challenge is going to do is delay the inevitable, but it's worth pursuing. Ghandi said, "Whatever you do in life will be insignificant but it is very important that you do it because you can't know." Will the challenges work? I think the chances that they will hover somewhere between zilch and none. But could they make a difference down the line? We can't know.
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