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To: NorseViking

Thank you for your perspective. I’ll offer mine:

I’ll offer what I know about the A-10: It can indeed maintain airspeed and altitude in a simple 45-deg turn.
Full loaded it can do it. Frogfoot cannot.

A-10/SU-25 can be compared side-by-side.

Frogfoot max speed slight advantage the Hog but loses airspeed and energy faster than the Hog.

The A-10 can operate on unimproved surfaces/”dirt” and that is why the engines are higher than all but the top of the rudders.

Triple redundant flight control system (two hydraulic systems to fly the jet if one fail and a manual reversion capability).

It’s redundant system and manual reversion is why Capt Campbell was able to fly the heavily damaged Hog back to safety. Frogfoot can’t do that.

Actually, munition are heavy and the Frogfoot needs bomb-loaders like the Hog.

“Regular” gas AND Diesel, never heard of that.

Frogfoot is not more protective than the A-10. Gulf War battle damaged A-10’s had an 80% survival rate if hit, whereas an F-16 had a 80% loss if hit.

Also, the Hog has a titanium “bathtub” around the cockpit and the Frogfoot pilot protection is weaker.

Spalling is not a factor for the A-10, smaller arms penetrate the Frogfoot.

A-10 has self-sealing fuel tanks and many control surfaces can be swapped with the other side.

No laser designator on the jet, but that technology is old technology and is now replaced with JDAMs and other smart munitions (SDB). The Hog can drop LGBs as part of a buddy-lase delivery.

A-10 carries AIM-9X heaters.
Adversary with heaters against an A-10 has a hard time getting a lock with a heater because of the high by-pass TF34 has a really cool exhaust. Basically, the cool engine exhaust requires an adversary to close to within about A-10 gun range.

Frogfoot is very limited in versatility.

Again, don’t sell the A-10 Gatling gun short. It has a 30mm like no other. 112,600 rpm, 3,400-3,600 FPS exiting the barrel, 10-rounds per barrel per second (7-barrels). That’s 70-rnds per second. However, to save the barrels, there is a limiter that allows about 3,900 rounds per second. Less than a second trigger pull. The old movies of aircraft walking their rounds to a target are no more.

Frogfoot has a gun that is nowhere near the rate and range and accuracy of the Hog’s 30mm.

Oh, and the gun can penetrate up to 1.5” of armor at 8,000’.

Frogfoot is closer to the A-9 that was part of the USAF’s original source-selection for a new CAS aircraft. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_YA-9).

A-9 lost.


74 posted on 09/30/2020 3:56:46 PM PDT by Hulka
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To: Hulka

I fully agree with you on the advantages of A-10 and don’t say it is worse, but you are selling Su-25 short.

You need to see what ‘dirt strip’ means for Su-25. Many won’t ride ATV on that. It need half the runway of A-10 also and that without a chute that might be employed also.

Regularly loaded Su-25 weights about 15 tons, A-10 about 22 tons. That is with engines of similar thrust. With R-195 engine it has about 10% more thrust.

You say that the speeds are largely similar but that if you compare the top speed of A-10 to the cruise speed of Su-25. Otherwise, Su-25 is two times as fast.

I realize that the wing profile of A-10 allows it to turn on a dime at low speed but you can’t beat physics at relugar regimes. Su-25s during Afghan war flew into narrow canyons to dig-out terrorists. Its wing is very well suited for low speed maneuvers too and heavily mechanized. It can turn in 450-500 meters and maintain energy. The landing speeds are similar. You won’t find published stall speed for Su-25 but some claims that it is half of that of A-10. And Su-25 is capable to sustain G-loads on par with regular Western fighters. What would make it lose energy at higher rate, given sturdier airframe, light weight, and same or higher horsepower?

R-95Sh turbojet is multifuel. It flies on everything that burns. That includes waste engine oil diluted by moonshine.
In fact many surplus engines are working as power generators on everything operators has.

As for protection the control surfaces of Su-25 are driven by 4 sm titanium rods.
There are exactly two recorded cases of aircraft shot down with HMG or autocannon. In one case it was due a to a bullet hitting the oxygen system rendering pilot unconscious.
Only 12 Su-25 pilots were killed during Afghan war. That’s given they were used very intensively and most aggressively. Only the strategic bombers delivered more payload at zero loss.


82 posted on 09/30/2020 8:09:43 PM PDT by NorseViking
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