Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: rustbucket

And yet all that crafty maneuvering by Lincoln could have been utterly undone if Davis had simply, you know, not ordered the bombardment of Sumter. But he had painted himself into a corner, and as I said, needed a war to get the other southern states to secede and to keep the enthusiasm for secession at a boil. So just as firm a case could be made that it was Davis who maneuvered the war into being.


742 posted on 05/10/2019 1:02:15 PM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("The rat always knows when he's in with weasels."--Tom Waits)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 740 | View Replies ]


To: Bubba Ho-Tep
And yet all that crafty maneuvering by Lincoln could have been utterly undone if Davis had simply, you know, not ordered the bombardment of Sumter. But he had painted himself into a corner, and as I said, needed a war to get the other southern states to secede and to keep the enthusiasm for secession at a boil. So just as firm a case could be made that it was Davis who maneuvered the war into being.

Here is what Jefferson Davis said [source: page 263 of "Lincoln Takes Command" by John Shipley Tilley, quoting from McElroy's "Jefferson Davis", volume 1, page 289-290; my bold below]

The order for the sending of the fleet was a declaration of war. The responsibility is on their shoulders, not ours. The juggle for position as to who shall fire the first shot in such an hour is unworthy of a great people and their cause. A deadly weapon has been aimed at our heart. Only a fool would wait until the first shot has been fired. The assault has been made. It is of no importance who shall strike the first blow or fire the first gun.

If Davis was so intent on starting the war, why did he send Commissioners to Washington to negotiate a peaceful separation from the Union? Lincoln wouldn't see the Commissioners, and Seward kept telling them and implying that Fort Sumter would be evacuated. Once the Commissioners realized that a war fleet was heading South, they "charged the Lincoln Administration with gross perfidy in attempting to reinforce Fort Sumter under pretext of evacuation" on April 11, 1861 [as reported in the April 13, 1861 "Daily Picayune" newspaper of New Orleans, see my old post Link to post 417].

If they wanted war so much. why didn't Davis attack Fort Pickens earlier before Lincoln sent his expedition down?

Governor Pickens of South Carolina also believed that the coming war fleet with the intention of forcing their way into the harbor represented that a state of war existed [Official Records, Serial I, Pages 292-293, April 9, 1861; my emphasis below].

State of South Carolina,
Headquarters, April 9, 1861.

Hon. Mr. Walker, Secretary of War:

Sir: At the request of General Beauregard I inclose the within. I took possession of the mails this morning from Sumter, and retained the packages marked "official." These are all sent you. The private letters are all sent, as directed, to their owners. I did this because I consider a state of war is now inaugurated by the authorities at Washington, and all information of a public nature was necessary to us. The mails and all intercourse of any kind with Sumter are now forbidden, and I immediately refused Captain Talbot any interview with Major Anderson, and also his request to be restored to his command in the fort. I called in General Beauregard, and made Captain Talbot and Mr. Chew repeat in his presence what they had said and what the former desired as to Sumter, and General Beauregard entirely and immediately concurred.

You will see by these letters of Major Anderson how it is intended to supply the fort; but by God's providence we will, I trust, be prepared for them; and if they approach with war vessels also, I think you will hear of as bloody a fight as ever occurred. We now have three thousand seven hundred men at the different posts and batteries, and will have by to-morrow three thousand more, which I have called down. From my calculation, I think they will have about two thousand six hundred, and will attempt to land in Launch-boats with 24 and 12 pounders, and it will probably be on the lower end of Morris Island, next the light-house. If so, we will have a fine rifle regiment to give them a cordial welcome from behind sand hills (that are natural fortifications), and two Dahlgren guns will be right on them, besides four 24-pounders in battery. I have four hundred fine Enfield rifles that have been practiced at nine hundred yards, and on that island, altogether, we have now one thousand nine hundred and fifty men, and are increasing it today.

There has just arrived on the bar a fine rifled cannon from Liverpool, of the latest maker (Blakely gun), an improvement upon Armstrong, of steel rolls or coils, with an elevation of seven and one-half degrees to a mile. It throws a shell or twelve-pound shot with the accuracy of a dueling-pistol, and only one and one-half pounds of powder. Such, they write me, is this gun, and I hope to have it in position to-night. We expect the attack about 6 o'clock in the morning, on account of the tide.

Very respectfully,
F. W. PICKENS.

Of course, an incoming missile from North Korea isn't an indication that a state of war exists. < /sarc >

755 posted on 05/11/2019 10:30:33 AM PDT by rustbucket
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 742 | View Replies ]

To: Bubba Ho-Tep; southernsunshine
Davis and Governor Pickens were in good company saying the Lincoln's expedition of warships threatening to force their way into Charleston Harbor was a declaration of war.

Here is Madison on the use of force against a state [Constitutional Convention, May 31, 1787; thanks to poster southernsunshine for the Madison quote]:

The use of force agst. a State, would look more like a declaration of war, than an infliction of punishment, and would probably be considered by the party attacked as a dissolution of all previous compacts by which it might be bound.

759 posted on 05/11/2019 12:59:53 PM PDT by rustbucket
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 742 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson