Posted on 03/20/2019 5:18:38 AM PDT by csvset
JAKARTA/SINGAPORE/PARIS (Reuters) - The pilots of a doomed Lion Air Boeing 737 MAX scoured a handbook as they struggled to understand why the jet was lurching downwards, but ran out of time before it hit the water, three people with knowledge of the cockpit voice recorder contents said
The captain asked the first officer to check the quick reference handbook, which contains checklists for abnormal events, the first source said.
For the next nine minutes, the jet warned pilots it was in a stall and pushed the nose down in response, the report showed. A stall is when the airflow over a plane’s wings is too weak to generate lift and keep it flying.
The captain fought to climb, but the computer, still incorrectly sensing a stall, continued to push the nose down using the plane’s trim system. Normally, trim adjusts an aircraft’s control surfaces to ensure it flies straight and level.
“They didn’t seem to know the trim was moving down,” the third source said. “They thought only about airspeed and altitude. That was the only thing they talked about.”
(Excerpt) Read more at reuters.com ...
Those blaming the Pilot in this case are just IDIOTS....
Yes the co pilot had few hours.. but the pilot had over 8000 hours of air time, and a spotless record...
BOEING and the FAA both failed completely... its clear the version of the max with only a single sensor should have never been certified for airworthiness. About 350 people are now dead, not because of Pilot error... the Human Failings for these crashes happened years before their flights on the drawing boards.
How the FAA ever allowed airworthiness certification for a plane that had a single point of failure in a system that could override pilot inputs is inexcusable.
Anyone blaming the Pilots in this just shows their willful ignorance.
“So, how many planes have to crash before it is safe to say there is a problem here?”
I don’t really like your tone, but I’m a civil guy, so I’ll respond.
How many poorly trained pilots flying on poorly run airlines need to crash perfectly good planes before you say there is a problem here?
The Ethiopian crash is, in some ways, worse than the Lion Air. After that crash last October, the world was flooded with information on the MCAS system. It was a headline for weeks and Boeing even issued a statement to all pilots about what they should do if there was a failure.
You would think that with hundreds of millions of non-pilots knowing a lot about the system from reading about it every day, a pilot paid to fly the 737-800 might have had a clue, wouldn’t you?
That’s why I think the cause of the Ethiopian is something other than pilots being clueless about MCAS.
That’s incredible. And dangerous. Hand fly should mean hand fly. Thanks
200 hours total time. In an airliner.....wow
Haiku Guy says that MCAS also operated while in autopilot; either way it was definitely running while the MAX was in manual mode, which as you say seems incredible and dangerous.
I heard someone who purported to be a transport pilot call in to a radio talk show and he made the same point as you are- hand fly should mean hand fly- otherwise the pilots can’t be sure of what they are encountering- the transport pilot said that there was nothing that those MAX planes were doing that pilots could not figure out and correct as long as they knew that the control surfaces were responding to their commands, and not something that the flight computer was deciding to do.
Bjorn’s Corner: The Ethiopian Airline’s Flight 302 crash
By Bjorn Fehrm
March 15, 2019, ©. Leeham News
https://leehamnews.com/2019/03/15/bjorns-corner-the-ethiopian-airlines-flight-302-crash/
See Pelham’s link at 114
(The manual trim adjust only lasts for 10 seconds, and then the MCAS lowers the nose again.)
Trim the stabilizer to normal then activate stab trim cutout switches.
If this doesn’t work, stab trim cutoff ON and use the trim wheels.
‘Runaway Stabilizer’ is part of pilot training. Clear indication on both sides of the pedestal that A/C was severely out of trim. Lion Air plane crashed with jackscrew in Full Nose Down condition.
Pilot Error #1 reason they died
It has been. And anyone paying attention to the story has seen them. Or check out the NASA database yourself.
Yep, just being a killjoy troll trying disrupt some perfectly good rants by throwing facts out there.
I've gotten to the point where I start with a Google search. Lots of YouTube videos that are useful, as well.
Amen to all!
Thanks! Yeah, that's my thinking, but to tell the truth, I know almost nothing about MCAS.
I have watched accident videos on YouTube. There is a great accident channel with computer recreations. There have been several accidents where pilots had indication errors, and the autopilot take inputs from the indication computers. Instead of hand flying the aircraft and using the standby gauges, they kept trying to get the autopilot to fly the plane again, and again, and again - until the autopilot flew them into the ground, or they fought the autopilot and flew themselves into the ground.
I hear what you are saying but if you have any aviation experience what we are learning is the way this “safety” system is designed defies common sense.
Dear God, the more I find out about this the more f’d up it becomes.
Major Clipton has it sized up exactly right....
These planes are HAL 9000’s!!!!
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