Posted on 10/30/2018 2:48:25 AM PDT by be-baw
GAME ON! BABY!!!!! To the Supreme Court. The Guat and Honduran invader columns made this possible! We owe these countries nothing! And include useless Mexico an El Salvador!
Cut ‘em all loose and Puerto Rico too. The Russians and Chinese can have them.
It takes 5 justices to “interpret” the Constitution to say whatever they want it to say. Those who subscribe to “original intent” are in the minority. Newly appointed Kavanaugh is definitely in the camp of continuing with established precedent.
Look, XIV (and XXII, for that matter) are horribly drafted and say things in plain English that contradict the intentions of the drafters.
But “some dead guy meant to say THIS” is not going to prevail, certainly not in a case like an EO over birthright citizenship. A President has the authority to order Secretary Pompeo not to issue passports to the US-born children of illegal aliens, he does not have the authority to define “subject to the jurisdiction of” in a way that binds future litigants or US district courts.
I think may have been given SS#s.
Here is the relevant text from the 14th Amendment:
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.
It all depends on the interpretation of the words “subject to the jurisdiction thereof.”
Are illegal entrants given that status?
As someone who has lobbied on the Hill on immigration matters for over 10 years, including stopping amnesty and eliminating birthright citizenship, I do more than just offer opinions. I spend time and effort (uncompensated) to change things.
“he does not have the authority to define “subject to the jurisdiction of” in a way that binds future litigants or US district courts.”
Sure he does. He’s the one that enforces the law. Don’t be silly.
CORRECT! And lets give credit to the marching columns of Guatemalans, Salvadorans, Hondurans etc that made this possible. They probe our defenses and The Donald has responded.
So TRUMP kills birth right citizenship and now we are on our way to a Supreme Court ruling.
Good point!
Quite a subtle argument, Electric. Clearly, the Constitution gives Congress the power of naturalization. Wong concerned natural born citizenship or birthright citizenship or citizenship at birth, not naturalization.
Congress plays a role regarding birthright citizenship, subject to the 14th Amendment since it was ratified.
While all person born here, subject to our laws, are birthright citizens by reason of the 14th Amendment, so too are persons born overseas of at least one U.S. citizen parent, (provided said U.S. citizen parent has invigorated his or her citizenship if he or her was born overseas).
The later form of natural born citizenship (by lineage, as opposed to place of birth) has its roots in English common law but was codified by law (that is, by Congress) and amended from the English common law in certain ways.
“While all person born here, subject to our laws, are birthright citizens by reason of the 14th Amendment”
Dead wrong. The reason for this thread, the discussion, and PDJT Trump’s E.O.
Btw, I’m always subtle
What Law Requires Birthright Citizenship?
Is automatic birthright citizenship for children of all legal and illegal aliens expressly required by the U.S. Constitution? On its face, the answer is “no.” No language in the Constitution specifically addresses how the children of foreigners must be dealt with in regards to citizenship. The 14th Amendment confers citizenship through “naturalization” or by birth to persons “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States, but provides no guidance on when an alien is to be regarded as subject to U.S. jurisdiction.
The next question, then, is whether any statute enacted by Congress specifically directs the granting of citizenship to children born in the United States to illegal aliens. Again, the answer is “no.” The executive branch’s birthright citizenship policy is not based on any federal regulation. One might say that the practice has become policy without becoming law.
Because the current policy has not been taken through the standard legislative or regulatory processes, it has become official practice without any input from the American public or their elected representatives. A recent survey found that only 33 percent of Americans support the practice of granting automatic citizenship to children born to illegal aliens.
https://cis.org/Report/Birthright-Citizenship-United-States (John Feere, 2010)
I think your hat is safe for another day!
Illegal aliens have deliberately avoided being subject to the jurisdiction of the United States. Hence their children would not be natural born citizens or citizens under the 14th amendment.
This is very awesome. This is quite dangerous for the lower courts to slap the injunction on because when it goes to Supreme court and he wins its then set in stone.
Precisely.
No executive order this impactful is ever justified. This is everything we rightly condemned Barky for doing. Given the language of the 14th I doubt anything short of a Costitutional Amendment or at least a SCOTUS decision could do this. And what happens when an executive order says well regulated militia ONLY means the National Guard and outlaws private ownership of firearms. I cannot believe Freepers could possibly agree with Trump’s methodology here.
Original intent of the 14th Amendment
Senator Jacob Howard (served on the Senate Joint Committee on Reconstruction, which drafted the 14th) clearly spelled out the intent of the 14th Amendment by stating:
"Every person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States. This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons. It settles the great question of citizenship and removes all doubt as to what persons are or are not citizens of the United States. This has long been a great desideratum in the jurisprudence and legislation of this country."
Sen. Lyman Trumbull, Chairman of the Judiciary Committee, author of the Thirteenth Amendment, and the one who inserted the phrase (All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and the States wherein they reside):
[T]he provision is, that 'all persons born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens.' That means 'subject to the complete jurisdiction thereof.' What do we mean by 'complete jurisdiction thereof?' Not owing allegiance to anybody else. That is what it means.
Sen. W. Williams:
I understand the words here, 'subject to the jurisdiction of the United States,' to mean fully and completely subject to the jurisdiction of the United States.
Senator Jacob Howard states the intent of the Fourteenth Amendment published in the Congressional Record May 30, 1866.
https://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=llcg&fileName=073/llcg073.db&recNum=11
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