Posted on 07/27/2018 5:28:26 AM PDT by Kaslin
Tuesday’s decision by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals means that people in the western U.S. will now be able to openly carry a handgun in public. The decision only applies to districts under the 9th Circuit’s jurisdiction, but it will likely soon affect the rest of the country. It is a huge ruling that strikes down existing state prohibitions in Hawaii and California.
The case involved George Young, who wanted to publicly carry a firearm in the State of Hawaii for personal self-defense. Young applied twice for a handgun permit to carry either openly or concealed, but they denied his application each time. Hawaii’s laws require demonstration of “reason to fear injury to the applicant’s person or property.” Similar rules apply to open carry. But, in fact, Hawaii refuses to acknowledge that anyone has good reason to fear for their safety and is not issuing a single permit.
The Second Amendment was clear when it enshrined the “right of the people to keep and bear Arms.” The Supreme Court has stated: “‘Keep arms’ was simply a common way of referring to possessing arms. . . . At the time of the founding, as now, to ‘bear’ meant to ‘carry.’” As with a previous decision by the 7th and DC Circuits, people have the right to carry. The government can’t stop otherwise law-abiding Americans from any ability to protect themselves outside their home.
Even states that never (Hawaii) or virtually never (California) issue concealed handgun permits will now have to allow people to openly carry handguns in a holster.
Gun control advocates could appeal the three 9th Circuit judges’ decision to the entire 9th Circuit (an en banc decision). The court as a whole is very liberal, and may very well reverse Tuesday’s decision. But such a ruling would definitely be appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court, which would presumably overturn it. This would make open carry legal nationwide.
Or gun control advocates could appeal directly to the Supreme Court, with the same result. President Trump’s election has made all the difference here.
To try to avoid a loss at the Supreme Court, the other option for gun control advocates is to accept their loss in the 9th Circuit and not appeal. Given the likely uproar in liberal Hawaii and California over people openly carrying guns on their hips, these liberal states will likely have to allow people to carry in some way and may revisit their extremely restrictive concealed handgun laws.
Outside of California, Hawaii, and New York, about 8.5 percent of adults nationwide have concealed handgun permits. In California, the percentage is about 0.4%, and in Hawaii it is 0%. This will have to change.
Even if Hawaii doesn’t appeal, the decision will still have ramifications for the rest of the country. The Supreme Court tends to limit itself to cases in which different circuit courts have made contradictory rulings. If other circuit courts rule against open carry, those decisions will be appealed and one will in all probability be accepted by the Supreme Court.
Gun control advocates thought that they had won in 2016, when the entire 9th Circuit ruled in Peruta v. County of San Diego that the Second Amendment does not protect the right to concealed carry. Then the court ignored Supreme Court precedent, probably in the expectation that Hillary Clinton would be elected president. The decision ignored the question of open carry, even though the plaintiffs argued that the 9th Circuit could ban either concealed or open carry, but not both.
The decision to ignore open carry in Peruta will now come back to haunt gun control activists. Elections also matter and with President Trump’s appointments to the Supreme Court, the 9th Circuit’s may realize this time it will have to follow the intent in earlier Supreme Court cases.
Given the overwhelming academic evidence that concealed handgun laws protect people’s safety and how law-abiding permit holders are, it is about time that the courts intervened.
A final outcome for the entire country may still be 4 or 5 years away, but it is just a matter of time. The eight states with very restrictive gun laws are going to have to change their rules.
Better practice your quick draw skills. Isaac Azimov’s Cave of Steel shows a 3 Musketeers like society in which only the blade or the pistol affords social order.
The eight state link doesn’t work. I am guessing Hawaii, California, New Jersey, Illinois, Connecticut, New York, Maryland and....Massachusetts? Rhode Island?
And just to underline the 2nd...every citizen should be forced to "bear arms"...see how the control freaks like living under a "law" THEY don't like like we had to.
“The decision only applies to districts under the 9th Circuit’s jurisdiction,“
And yet a single 9th Circuit judge can make his immigration ruling apply nationwide.
Seems right.
L
Agreed. Open carry invites disarms. What will prevent someone from grabbing a visible gun? (and please, no one say ‘buckled holster’)
Guess you’ve never owned a business or a farm. What do you care if someone carries openly? Your opinion is wrong and based on fear and ignorance.
The forces of gun control will clamor for a rehearing of the case before an 11-judge panel.
You sound like a snowflake, next you will be complaining that concealed carry is a ‘honey trap’ and some one got shot because if they knew the person was armed they wouldn’t have accosted them.
Both posts are limiting the viewpoint.
In most situations, open carry is dumb. Open carriers would probably be the first targets. For farm/rural settings, it makes more sense.
Make it legal, and let it take its course.
If a person is bold enough to jump someone armed, what do you think they are willing to do to an unarmed person?
> With the Ninth Circus, it ain’t over ‘til it’s over en banc. <
Right you are. This latest ruling was just made by a three-judge panel, two of whom are rather conservative. I predict that the entire Ninth Circuit will take this up, and they will overturn this panel’s ruling.
That’s just the way the Ninth Circuit rolls (until Trump can get a few of his own picks on it).
> I will always think open carry, though LEGAL is stupid. <
I agree with you, but for different reasons. I feel open carry is unnecessarily provocative. Concealed carry should require no permit. That’s the 2A in action. It’s open carry that should require the permit.
Here’s why, by example. I live about a quarter of a mile from a high school. I can see it from my front porch. So let’s suppose I’m sitting on my front porch, and it’s 10 minutes before school lets out. A young man quickly walks past me heading towards the school, carrying a slung rifle.
What should I do? See something, say something? But he is really doing nothing wrong (I live in an open-carry state).
Bottom line: Firearms are in a way like erotica (or porno, if you wish). The Constitution acknowledges your right to carry such things around. But keep it concealed.
Your statement assumes little to no adoption of open carry after it’s allowed. I presume that it would become fairly commonplace. Open carriers would not in that case be the first targets of violence, they’d be the least likely.
Illinois has gotten much better. We passed CCW a few years ago and even the Trib had to admit it has gone well. There are several good apps available that can keep you informed on state laws.
“An armed society is a polite society.” - Heinlein.
IIRC, when many states were eliminating obsolete laws, MA law enforcement was waiting at the doors of every church one Sunday. They arrested every male aged eighteen and older. It seems there was a law, from the days it was a colony, that required every male to carry a firearm whenever they left their domicile. Didn’t take long for that law to be repealed!
Which comes from experience.
Sorry, but I grew up in a rural area and open carry was common. That was a long time ago.
While I saw a few carriers, it was relatively rare, and the instances have gone down.
As I said previously, in a rural setting it makes more sense.
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