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To: Parmy
there is no such thing as 'free trade'

Before the 1900's there was no such thing as man in flight. Did that mean that the ability to fly didn't exist? NO! It meant that man did not know that he COULD fly and what it would take to do so. But the priciples of flight were there all the time.

Same thing with the free market. The voluntary cooperation between buyers and sellers in the marketplace free from government interference exists all the time, but if people don't take advantage of it, it lays dormant like the principles of flight did. By definition, the voluntary cooperation of the free market means buyers and/or sellers do not have to buy or sell ANYTHING. It works on one's own best interests regardless of what the other guy does.

In the meantime, there is no such thing as free trade that is also fair trade. The two are diametrically opposed. "Free" means no government interference and "fair" mean government command and control. Wanting "fair" trade means you don't want or believe in free trade or the free market.

But don't tell me that like the principles of flight, that the principles of the free market don't exist. The free market is wealth waiting to happen. America in the 1800's is a good example of the free market, the feds being around 5% of the GDP, not a factor in the marketplace that was free from government interference. It existed then and does and can now and it DOES NOT depend on what China or anyone else does.

You fail to understand that it doesn't matter how oppressive other countries can be about their own trade rules. We can exercise our free market trading and come out ahead no matter what they other guys does.

43 posted on 06/30/2018 2:29:50 PM PDT by Jim W N (MAGA by restoring the Gospel of the Grace of Christ and our Free Constitutional Republic!)
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To: Jim 0216
I don't know what flight has to do with economics. That is a digression from the topic and has no relation to what we are discussing.

"We can exercise our free market trading and come out ahead no matter what they other guys does."

The only problem with that statement is that is isn't working in our favor and it hasn't worked in history, as well.

If is nice theory, but not reality especially when there is recipricosity. Ergo, the imbalance of trade with such as China.

I will give you an example. For instance, in Washington State the cherry harvest is in full swing. China will take in a certain number of tons of cherries, when they are ready to. Prior to that time there are excessive restrictions, tariffs and quality restrictions. Then when their designated quota is reached the import of cherries will stop.

But from an economic standpoint a container holds about 2000 cartons of cherries worth for the sake of example about $84,000 plus freight. Which incidentally is discounted because the freight companies want to get the containers back to China with some cargo, rather than empty.

Now, after that same container is unloaded in China, China could for example will it with hammers destined for the U.S. market.

Each hammer weighs about 1.25 lbs. The container can hold 80,000 lbs. of them totaling 64000 hammers. If for example, each hammer is priced to the distributor at $10.00 each, that means that container which originally contained $84,000 worth of cherries to China is now loaded with $640,000 worth of hammers. Hence the imbalance of trade.

So, with the implementation of tariffs on the hammers, China has a lot to lose. Where can they sell those hammers if sales fall in the U.S.

As I said, there is more to meet the eye than esoteric theory. One has to look at the whole picture.

44 posted on 06/30/2018 9:49:54 PM PDT by Parmy
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