GM warns import tariffs could lead to a smaller company (Bovine Excrement)

You are failing to understand that there is no such thing as 'free trade'. Anyone who has had export dealings knows the unfair hurdles that U.S. business has to go through to sell U.S. product to countries that utilize protectionist tariffs to keep U.S. products uncompetitive in their respective countries. And, not only do they us exhorbatent high tariffs, they use restrictive trade barriers as well.

I already said that previously. I guess you didn't pay any attention.

Trump is right in that Mexico and Canada have engaged in putting high tariffs on U.S. products to keep them out of their respective countries. Canada putting more tariffs on U.S. products over and about those already in place is just redundant.

there is no such thing as 'free trade'

Before the 1900's there was no such thing as man in flight. Did that mean that the ability to fly didn't exist? NO! It meant that man did not know that he COULD fly and what it would take to do so. But the priciples of flight were there all the time.

Same thing with the free market. The voluntary cooperation between buyers and sellers in the marketplace free from government interference exists all the time, but if people don't take advantage of it, it lays dormant like the principles of flight did. By definition, the voluntary cooperation of the free market means buyers and/or sellers do not have to buy or sell ANYTHING. It works on one's own best interests regardless of what the other guy does.

In the meantime, there is no such thing as free trade that is also fair trade. The two are diametrically opposed. "Free" means no government interference and "fair" mean government command and control. Wanting "fair" trade means you don't want or believe in free trade or the free market.

But don't tell me that like the principles of flight, that the principles of the free market don't exist. The free market is wealth waiting to happen. America in the 1800's is a good example of the free market, the feds being around 5% of the GDP, not a factor in the marketplace that was free from government interference. It existed then and does and can now and it DOES NOT depend on what China or anyone else does.

You fail to understand that it doesn't matter how oppressive other countries can be about their own trade rules. We can exercise our free market trading and come out ahead no matter what they other guys does.

I don't know what flight has to do with economics. That is a digression from the topic and has no relation to what we are discussing.

"We can exercise our free market trading and come out ahead no matter what they other guys does."

The only problem with that statement is that is isn't working in our favor and it hasn't worked in history, as well.

If is nice theory, but not reality especially when there is recipricosity. Ergo, the imbalance of trade with such as China.

I will give you an example. For instance, in Washington State the cherry harvest is in full swing. China will take in a certain number of tons of cherries, when they are ready to. Prior to that time there are excessive restrictions, tariffs and quality restrictions. Then when their designated quota is reached the import of cherries will stop.

But from an economic standpoint a container holds about 2000 cartons of cherries worth for the sake of example about $84,000 plus freight. Which incidentally is discounted because the freight companies want to get the containers back to China with some cargo, rather than empty.

Now, after that same container is unloaded in China, China could for example will it with hammers destined for the U.S. market.

Each hammer weighs about 1.25 lbs. The container can hold 80,000 lbs. of them totaling 64000 hammers. If for example, each hammer is priced to the distributor at $10.00 each, that means that container which originally contained $84,000 worth of cherries to China is now loaded with $640,000 worth of hammers. Hence the imbalance of trade.

So, with the implementation of tariffs on the hammers, China has a lot to lose. Where can they sell those hammers if sales fall in the U.S.

As I said, there is more to meet the eye than esoteric theory. One has to look at the whole picture.

Guess I lost you on the analogy that basically says if you don’t see it, it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. Very relevant to your statement that “there is not such thing as free trade”. Saying that is like those before Benjamin Franklin saying, “There no such thing as electricity.”

Moving on - as “curative protective tariffs” is a fiction, so are the inflammatory and fictional phrases that are oft repeated, such as “trade imbalance”, a fiction, trying to pound submissive support for protective tariffs into the hearers. But “trade imbalance” as an issue is a fiction.

In your example, if growers in Washington State (WS) choose to sell cherries and China chooses to buy them at an agreed price and quantity, WS has exercised its freedom to sell in the marketplace regardless of how much the Chinese government has interfered on the Chinese buying side. WS finds profit is selling to China at the accepted and agreed upon price regardless. Both WS and China see a benefit to themselves in the transaction or else at least WS would not voluntarily sell to China.

And if U.S. companies voluntarily choose to buy hammers from China it is only because it is in U.S. companies’ best business interest to do so regardless of whatever the Chinese government is doing. If U.S buyers are not benefited by the transaction they will not engage in it.

The voluntary buying and selling in the marketplace free from government interference creates wealth to the side or sides of the transaction that is/are free from government interference. Our economy is not adversely affected if there’s a net inflow of goods and services (”trade imbalance”). Those goods and services go right to work into domestic buying and selling creating investment and production making our economy stronger and better regardless of what China does on their end.

Back to the issue at hand, as the article quotes GM, “the tariffs could hike vehicle prices and reduce sales. Even if automakers opted not to pass on higher costs ‘this could still lead to less investment, fewer jobs, and lower wages for our employees. The carry-on effect of less investment and a smaller workforce could delay breakthrough technologies’.”

“Protective tariffs” not only don’t solve the core issues I listed in an earlier post, they make matters worse.

If what you say is true, then this begs these questions. Why are more people working now than is many years? Why is a certain steel mill starting up another furnace and hiring people who have been out of work for a least two year due to steel shutting down because of no tariffs?

Why has logging started up again where I live?

Way is the black and hispanic unemployment rate the lowest ever? Why are more women going back to work and their unemployment rate dropping?

Why is the growth rate set to exceed 3 %, shortly, especially when Obama had several quarters of negative growth? And, many quarters during his terms in office had a hard time cracking the 1% mark.

Why are there now so many 'help wanted' signs in business windows?

I could go on. One more thing, business are expanding and now the excess money is beginning to dry up so banks are offering higher interest rates to their depositors.

I know that what you are espousing classic, esoteric economic theory, but theory is only good if it works. And that theory doesn't work and hasn't for a long time, if ever.

Needless to say this has been fun. So, goodbye and have a nice day and a good life.

All of the above...

Mainly tax cuts and massively cutting suffocating government regulations.

As Reagan once said, government isn't the solution, it is the problem.

Get rid of federally protected unions, high taxes, regulations, minimum wage, subsidies, and a weak dollar that all have converged to “bind and gag” American business and drive industry from our shores - and this will not just be a temporary turnaround but a permanent economic boom for America.

That's not esoteric economic theory, that's a fact, Jack.

Thanks for the conversion and I hope some good came out of it. Remember, freedom isn't perfect, but it is way ahead of whatever's in second place.

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