Posted on 01/30/2018 6:28:34 AM PST by Kaslin
"Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God." (Romans 13:1)
That verse, written by Paul the Apostle, is one of the most difficult for modern evangelicals to fully accept. It was written at a time when the Roman authorities were bad dudes. They actively discriminated against the early Christians, murdering some, imprisoning others, including Paul, who was among their most ardent persecutors before his conversion.
Modern Christians sometimes suffer from the notion that God is only active when someone they voted for wins an election and that He must have gone on holiday when the candidate they didn't vote for prevails.
My personal history with this attitude goes back to the days of Jimmy Carter, who openly proclaimed himself to be "born again," a phrase taken from the mouth of Jesus which caused many Republican evangelicals to vote for him in 1976 (but not in 1980 when he ran against Ronald Reagan, a divorced man who rarely attended church, but whose policies, like President Trump's, were lauded by evangelicals).
I attended church with Carter. He was an excellent Bible teacher and still is from what I hear. The problem for evangelicals occurred when it came to policy. Despite his fealty to Scripture, Carter enforced the "Roe v. Wade" Supreme Court ruling and was OK with same-sex marriage. He said Jesus never spoke against homosexuality, as if the rest of Scripture says nothing about it, or any other "social issue."
Some evangelical friends of mine are dumping on President Trump because of his personal history. Too many others are vigorously defending, even inexplicably excusing, his bad behavior.
Many conservative critics of the president prefer the image of a loving family exhibited by former President Barack Obama. And yet Obama's policies were antithetical to what many evangelicals believe. So are Hillary Clinton's, not to mention the "family values" portrait she and husband Bill have shown to the world. Some evangelicals have actually suggested they would have preferred Hillary as president, though Donald Trump is presiding over a roaring economy, naming solid constitutional conservatives to high courts, defeating ISIS, trying to control illegal immigration and putting America and Americans first, all issues with which they agree.
I like to ask Trump's evangelical critics if they ever pray for him, as Paul also instructed believers to do: "I urge you, first of all, to pray for all people. Ask God to help them; intercede on their behalf, and give thanks for them. Pray this way for kings and all who are in authority so that we can live peaceful and quiet lives marked by godliness and dignity. This is good, and pleases God our Savior (1 Timothy 2:1-3, New Living Translation).
The question could also be asked another way and I have asked it of evangelical friends: "How many of you prayed for President Obama when he was in office?" Not many I have learned, except perhaps in a perfunctory way while we "bless all the missionaries of the world and all those in authority."
It is a familiar analogy, but one that should be stressed again. If I am about to have surgery, I care less about a person's religion, sexual orientation or lifestyle than I do about how many of the surgeon's patients were healed of their afflictions.
It might make some evangelicals feel better to have a president who is one of them while also displaying conservative values, but if one has to choose, I'll take the issues and listen to my pastor, who speaks of a kingdom not of this world, which is far better than a corrupt kingdom that is passing away.
Thus ends today's "sermon." We can now take up the collection.
I don’t look at my president for spiritual guidance. I learned my lesson after I voted for Carter. I even worked in his campaign. Now I vote for who I believe will be the best leader for America.
Evangelicals have never learned from the scandals of the late-80s.
They still lord over people with this attitude of righteousness, while they are totally fine with heaping cash on mega-churches and furnishing scam preachers with millions of dollar in exchange for “blessings”.
So they will have to excuse us when we are willing to get “dirty” so that they dont have to get railroaded by the deep state.
“[Carter] was an excellent Bible teacher and still is from what I hear...He said Jesus never spoke against homosexuality...”
“From what I hear” does not jive with “Jesus never spoke...”
“Too many others are vigorously defending, even inexplicably excusing, [Trump’s] bad behavior.”
Who set him up as Trump’s judge? As Paul said, love covers a multitude of sins. That would encompass love and loyalty to the country he represents.
“Many conservative critics of the president prefer the image of a loving family exhibited by former President Barack Obama.”
Talk about a banal, stupid statement. Would Obama exhibit any other kind?
“Some evangelicals have actually suggested they would have preferred Hillary as president...”
Well, they have to be completely stupid and ignorant.
“How many of you prayed for President Obama when he was in office?”
Am I supposed to feel guilt if I did not?
I agree with you. And I go a step further: If someone professes to be a Christian but votes for someone who is fine with murdering the unborn, sending people to tell for condoning the sin of homosexuality, and wants Israel to give up their home, I don’t consider them to know the Bible or be Christ-like at all.
Please let us know what perfect church you belong to so we can all go.The author and you need to actually go to some Evangelical churches before making sweeping assumptions.
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I didnt profession any perfection.
I also am not one of these “evangelicals” that dont seem to grasp the realities of politics today.
If enough of these express some seething dislike of Trump, then they ARE a problem, and need a hard dose of reality.
“Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.” (Romans 13:1)
“How many of you prayed for President Obama when he was in office?”
False premise. According to the Constitution, “We the People” are the governing authority in the US, and the Federal government is to be limited in power. The President is a public servant that exercises authority as a steward for the people, not as a monarch or dictator.
I pray always the President, whoever it might be, govern in a way that honors God, and if not, that the President will be replaced by someone who will.
I agree. Most of my friends travel in evangelical circles and I daresay none of them meet his description.
If anything, a few would be completely opposite, flat out refusing to consider voting for someone based solely on their stance on social issues, especially that of abortion.
I got into a pretty strident argument with a guy during the primaries. He has since passed away, but was a very strong pro-life supporter and truly a single issue voter.
He said that he wouldn’t consider voting for any candidate who didn’t hold pro-life credentials at least as strong as his own. (he was an ardent pro-life campaigner)
My argument was that such a position is perfectly fine and laudable in the primary, but during the general election, ones absolute duty is to vote for the candidate who closely mirrors your beliefs, but probably not exactly.
In the current climate, that will always be the Republican as the Democrats have become members of the holy sacramental religion of abortion and every deviant behavior known to man.
He said he’d not vote for anyone, at which point I said “fine, then you’re not allowed an opinion for four years.”
This was at a church Bible Study and the leader finally had to break us up, later agreeing with my position.
“Does not compute”, for sure.
My cousin is a friend of Cal Thomas’ — attends my cousin’s kids’ weddings, etc. I believe Cal is Roman Catholic unless that has recently changed. If he is, then he probably doesn’t understand Evangelicals. I like Cal, but I don’t think he “gets it”.
You can’t be an “excellent Bible teacher” and promote homosexuality and abortion. Does not compute
Cal is not Catholic. He considers himself an Evangelical Christian.
Interesting. About 20 years ago my cousin told me he was Catholic. Doesn’t matter. The Scripture he quotes is good. (It’s Scripture; of course it’s good!)
Cal's roots are with Jerry Falwell, founder and pastor (now deceased) of Thomas Road Baptist Church, Lynchburg, VA, also founder of Liberty University and the Moral Majority.
FReegards!
This message isn’t meant for most people on FR. He is right. He is aiming at people who claim to be believers but are so against Trump because he is “mean” or “_______” (name any claim form #neverTrumpers or MSM OR some like Russell Moore). Ben Sasse comes to mind first. Even World Magazine has writers that seem to still be in that park. Young evangelicals sometimes. The claim they make is that evangelicals have supported socially conservative issues and now support of Trump has discredited our authority. I think I understand it that way. However, I strongly disagree. Trump has done more in action than any outwardly “righteous” politician I can remember. I call people who still grouse about Trump Christian Superiorists. They don’t like that. I have lived long enough to understand this is one case similar to Matthew 21:28-32. I prefer people that do what they say instead of saying the right thing and finding a way not to do it.
If it wasn’t for Evangelicals, we’d have had Democrats in the White House for the last 30 years. We aren’t against “getting dirty” if it’s done legally. What Evangelical does not want the law enforced? We’ve been the ones beaten over the head under Obama’s reign. Trump is my President, not my Savior.
In this country, WE THE PEOPLE are the ones in authority. Those people in Washington and (in my case) Lansing are our servants, our hirelings. Even Trump.
WE are the masters. We fulfill the words of Paul when we pray for ourselves, especially on election day.
In defense of Evangelicals, I personally do not associate them with the megachurches. Those who go to the megachurches with the flamboyant pastors are not typical Evangelicals, at least I don’t think of them that way.
Of course, I am a Catholic, so what do I know about it?
I would say that you have nailed it
More detailed preaching on this is I and II Peter. Arg.
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