The F-14 is not a fixed-wing. That picture is a fixed-wing aircraft.
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It is an F-14 with it's wings in the non-sweep mode -
Posted on 11/20/2015 7:10:21 PM PST by sukhoi-30mki
I know one thing for sure, and that is the Shah was PERSONALLY & COMPLETELY against the communists in Iran or Iranian commies residing outside Iran at that time. The commies and their various political parties in Iran were massive trouble makers and rather stupid compared to the Islamists.
Moreover, the Shah was always pro-Republican U.S. presidents because he felt that they understood his goals for a modern, secular Iran much better than the Dems.
No way.
I think there were a lot of illegal spares shipments going on. This 2007 WaPo article describes the problem -
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/21/AR2007012100760.html
That does not look like an F-14 to me .. I used to watch them fly out of Miramar almost daily.
The F-14 is not a fixed-wing. That picture is a fixed-wing aircraft.
Yes. I had the privilege of being a member of the duty personnel welcoming home the American POWs aboard the Lockheed C-141 Starlifter dubbed the Hanoi Taxi in 1973. It was a treat to see how the museum is preserving the aircraft and was used in its old markings to repatriate the remains of our veterans recovered in Vietnam.
You got it right. There are some reports about the shenanigans that went on with that circulating around on the Internet and in past articles posted on FR.
The F-14 is not a fixed-wing. That picture is a fixed-wing aircraft.
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It is an F-14 with it's wings in the non-sweep mode -
Well, the drawing shows the wing is LONGER than in an F-14 - because when the wing swings back to form the delta, it is the same length as the tail portion .. and that drawing clearly shows that if you swept the wing back, it would be longer .. not the same length as the tail piece.
That’s a very strange looking drawing.
It still doesn’t look right to me.
Give it up! This plane is instantly recognizable, even to the most casual afficiando ( i.e. me ) ... I watched the movie.
They took delivery of 79 F14s and can maybe put up 20 to 25 now. They would of course scavenge parts off the surviving non-flyable air frames.
USN Tomcats shot down four opponents while the Iranians have 100+ kills against Iraq.
Dick Chaney ordered destruction of the F14 tooling during the Daddy Bush regime.
Iranians say lots of things.
Their F-14's and their Phoenix missiles were supposedly sabotaged after the Revolution.
In any case, it would be really, really hard to keep up the maintenance of them without access to batteries and spare parts.
Iran was supplied with the original analog AIM-54 version of the missile that was replaced with a digital version shortly after the revolution making acquisition of spares even harder.
Whatever shoot downs they had in the 80's Iran-Iraq war would have been with AIM-7 Sparrows (good luck with that) or AIM-9 Sidewinders.
Shortly after Jimmy Carter made it into the White House, the need for arming Iran with the first line American air superiority fighters quickly evaporated. After Viktor Belenko defected to Japan with a Soviet MiG 25 at the end of 1976, the intelligence services were able to determine the true capabilities and limitations of the MiG 25 Foxbat. Armed with this knowledge, the need for the F-15 or F14 in the Imperial Iranian Air Force (IIAF) quickly deflated just as the hostile Iranian Islamist revolutionaries threatened to overthrow Iran and gain control of the F-14 aircraft. Unwilling to renege on the contract with Iran and the promise to the Shah, President Carter refused to suspend deliveries of the F-14 aircraft and spare parts despite growing concerns that the F-14 aircraft could fall into hostile Iranian control and be handed over to the Soviet Union, which did happen.
“Shortly after Jimmy Carter made it into the White House, the need for arming Iran with the first line American air superiority fighters quickly evaporated.”
“Unwilling to renege on the contract with Iran and the promise to the Shah, President Carter refused to suspend deliveries of the F-14 aircraft and spare parts despite growing concerns that the F-14 aircraft could fall into hostile Iranian control and be handed over to the Soviet Union, which did happen.”
I read the above paragraphs as somewhat contradictory, because Carter became “unwilling to renege on the contract” especially when he knew Islamists were going to depose of the Shah because Carter supported the Islamists?
The contract for F-14’s with Iran was signed during Nixon-Ford years; “The initial order signed in January of 1974 covered 30 Tomcats, but in June 50 more were added to the contract.”
According to this source: http://www.iiaf.net/aircraft/jetfighters/F14/f14.html
“The Iranian Tomcats were fairly late on the production line, and were therefore delivered with the TF30-P-414 engine, which was much safer than the compressor-stall-prone P-412 engine. The first 2 of 79 Tomcats arrived in Iran in January of 1976. By May of 1977, when Iran celebrated the 50th anniversary of the Royal House, 12 had been delivered. At this time, the Soviet MiG-25 Foxbats were still making a nuisance of themselves by flying over Iran, and the Shah ordered live firing tests of the Phoenix to be carried out as a warning. In August of 1977, IIAF crews shot down a BQM-34E drone flying at 50,000 feet, and the Soviets took the hint and Foxbat over flights promptly ended.”
Read more at link. Interesting and in many parts very detailed/specific.
Yes, I’m well aware of all of that and more. What I am saying is that a variety of other events about which Carter and his advisers had been well informed and warned about in the preceding years were rendering the interception of the Soviet Mig-25 Foxbat reconnaissance missions a moot issue in the face of the already unfolding Islamic revolution in Iran. For example, look at the role played by the CIA which the Saudis had long warned would result in the Shah and his Imperial Guard being deposed and the deliveries of the F-14 Tomcats destined to fall into enemy hands. See:
The United States and Iran: The Secret History Part One: Carter and the Shah
By Joseph Trento and Susan Trento, on July 27th, 2009
Although the activities of the CIA with respect to the Islamic revolutionaries was covert, we of the American public at the time were informed well enough to see Carter was recklessly sending some of the most sophisticated and sensitive American weapons of war to an Iran apparently on the edge of an Islamic revolution hostile to the United States, even as Carter was starving our own military forces to the point where they were becoming incapable of maintain their combat ready status. Carter’s policies denied me the uniform reissue I was supposed to receive as a part of my service compensation. The 1st Tactical Fighter Wing was denied the funds to purchase enough fuel for their pilots to maintain their minimum flight competency in their new F-15 Eagle fighter aircraft, and they were denied the procurement funds necessary to purchase the engines and parts to keep their new F-15 Eagle fighter aircraft from being grounded for maintenance items. All the while we saw our military forces being starved for essential resources, our military families denied decent military housing, and our military equipment sold to potential enemies; we anticipated with grim concern as Carter equipped Iran with F-14 aircraft as he crippled our Navy’s F-14 air groups with cuts in military funding and aircraft parts. That is why the Shah’s air force could fund the AIM testing while our military could not. That is why those of us who remember those days are so critical of Carter pretending the underway Islamic revolution in Iran did not imminently jeopardize the F-14 security and our own nation’s security. We immediately recognized that arming the Iranians with the F-14 with continued deliveries of the F-14 to counter the MiG-25 was no longer realistic when it was increasingly clear they would end up in the hands of a hostile Islamic revolutionary regime.
In the opinions of many of us, Carter continued to deliver the F-14 Tomcats to Iran in the belief it would help to win the revolutionary Islamic regime’s alliance after the Shah’s ouster, in the mistaken belief these Islamic extremists could be negotiated with.
It’s too late for me to respond with much. I had already taken my sleeping pills before seeing your post.
I have come to know you as a very thoughtful critical thinker. I hope you’re wrong, but I suspect you’re right. We certainly live in interesting times.
Ok, right, we’re on the same page.
“In the opinions of many of us, Carter continued to deliver the F-14 Tomcats to Iran in the belief it would help to win the revolutionary Islamic regime’s alliance after the Shah’s ouster, in the mistaken belief these Islamic extremists could be negotiated with.”
In my view, the delivery of F-14’s was least of the problems caused by Carter at the time. Carter threw the entire geopolitics of the region into chaos, which continues to date. My biggest issue with Carter alone is not only he is still permitted to run around and offer ‘foreign policy’ advice, but he was also given a Nobel Peace Prize. Nothing has been learned from his dire mistakes - people like him should be in a straight-jacket, firmly locked up.
GE ignored sanctions on Iran, with impunity.
Do they manufacture some of these parts?
By the time Obama leaves office, they will be so well dug in they will never leave.
In a matter of a year, Saudi Arabia has gone from being the dominant power in the Middle East to being isolated and surrounded by hostile players in the region.
Obama has destroyed 50 years of bi partisan American policy world wide, and no place more so than in the Middle East. The implications are very disturbing and economically, Obama may have destroyed the Petro Dollar
Your thorough tactical analysis is disquieting enough but the implications on a strategic level are very frightening.
Consider the whether the Russian raids, especially as they are directed not against Isis but against United States supported rebels, are in service not so much in the Russian grudge against Isis but in service to its new allies, Iran, Iraq and Syria, constituting a new caliphate possessed with Russian might and nuclear weapons and determined to upset the balance of power in that part of the world which still produces the most oil.
Consider whether the participation by France with the Russians and their evident tactical coordination with the Russians suggests that the always fickle French might be the first in a series of European powers to consider forsaking the NATO alliance (and that really means forsaking America) to throw their lot in with the Russians. The same Russians who are supplying Europe with oil and gas and who are bidding fare to take over or at least interdict Mideast oil and its flow toward Europe. If so, could Germany be far behind?
Are we witnessing the formation of a new world power put together with elements from NATO, Russia and China? If so, the implications are utterly catastrophic.
Consider whether such a new strategic alliance would somehow align itself with Islam. Before rejecting that possibility out of hand we ought to consider the extremely high minority in France who support Islam, some large portion of which is "Christian." Could any of these considerations be behind a massive display of firepower designed not just to destroy Isis, against whom apparently they are only partially directed anyway, but to intimidate neighboring Arab nations and, ultimately, Europe? Is this really a tactical or a strategic matter?
All in all, we had better consider who the enemy in the theater really is. Are we being diverted toward shiny objects in our reaction to Isis when the real enemy is more than a bunch of murderous diaper heads but a real nuclear caliphate bent on global dominance? In our obsession with Isis are we enlarging the Obama created a vacuum which leaves a perfect opening for very dangerous forces?
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