Remembering Stan 3: The Anti-McCarthy Tripwire

DianaWest.net ^ | March 6, 2015 | Diana West

[Oratam]

biblio bump

[Fiji Hill]

No audio transcription was made of McCarthy’s Wheeling speech.

[Jeff Chandler]

I linked to the entire text of McCarthy’s Wheeling speech

No, you linked to an undocumented calumny of the senator's speech. For actual documentation, read Evan's book.

As for Joe releasing the names, he thought it irresponsible to do so because some of those people may have been innocent. BTW, the Venona Papers as well as Soviet documents have subsequently vindicated Joe.

McCarthy Was Right

This entire article is about what you are doing: accepting the lies and the slanders against Senator McCarthy.

I know it's painful to accept that one's worldview has been based upon false information, but do yourself a favor, read Evan's book. The documentation he provides makes his case iron clad.

Of course, if your only goal is to win this argument . . .

[Jeff Chandler]

By the time they finished they concluded that Watergate was orchestrated by John Dean on his own for his own purpose.

But every news article, every opinion piece, every history book will tell you differently, because none of those institutions are about Truth, they are about the Leftist Narrative. Same with the narrative on McCarthy.

[subterfuge]

“appears to”? Prove it.

[Zionist Conspirator]

David Horowitz and the folks at Front Page Magazine are great folks and have done yeoman service in combating the Left, but for some reason they still have an allergy to McCarthy. Maybe he is a symbol to them of WWII isolationism, the "Old Right," and anti-Semitism. And this is strange because, although many such people supported McCarthy, that does not make him one of them. Even The Jewish Press has cleared Senator McCarthy of the slightest tint of anti-Semitism and he was certainly no Bob Taft isolationist in his views about foreign policy. But for the Front Page people McCarthy remains forever tarred by those Old Rightists and anti-Semites who did support him.

It has sometimes been claimed that McCarthy was anti-Zionist because he was a great admirer of the undoubtedly anti-Zionist James V. Forrestal. Yet George C. Marshall held views on the Middle East identical to Forrestal's and yet McCarthy devoted a famous speech to attacking him, forcing him to resign his position.

As for Ms. West's tussle with FPM about World War II--I'm not getting in between them on that one.

[Zionist Conspirator]

McCarthy began working the theme of Communist infiltration of the US Government in 1950. He was late to the party and didn’t have any original information. He was reckless and made claims that he couldn’t back up.

::Sigh:: Here comes the regurgitation of standard anti-McCarthy bromides without a scintilla of proof.

May I suggest you actually read Evans' book?

[Zionist Conspirator]

In the speech he makes this claim:

” And, ladies and gentlemen, while I cannot take the time to name all the men in the State Department who have been named as active members of the Communist Party and members of a spy ring. I have here in my hand a list of 205—a list of names that were made known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping policy in that State Department.”

He never produced any such list at any time. In subsequent references he made claims of 81, 57, and 10 names. He never produced any names.

May I suggest again that you read Mr. Evans' book which deals with this issue at length?

You keep repeating liberal anti-McCarthy talking-points like they've been programmed into you. Do you perhaps believe he was some sort of Nazi sympathizer? If so, why don't you come right out and say so?

[Zionist Conspirator]

Actually McCarthy did name names. Dwight Eisenhower and George Marshall among them, two of the most important Generals from WWII. IIRC he impugned them as traitors and dupes. If that doesn’t illustrate the irresponsible and crackpot nature of Joe McCarthy nothing will.

To my knowledge, McCarthy never branded Eisenhower a traitor or a dupe. You are thinking of a completely different person, the late Robert Henry Winborne Welch Jr., founder of the John Birch Society, who made the charges against Eisenhower--after McCarthy's death.

I find I can no longer continue perusing this thread. Mr. Evans researched the subject for six years and his conclusions are in black and white yet you insist on maintaining your ignorance. This is too much for my blood pressure.

How can someone be so dogmatically blind about a non-religious topic when the facts have been laid bare to all?

[Pelham]

"::Sigh:: Here comes the regurgitation of standard anti-McCarthy bromides without a scintilla of proof. "

Funny you should say that since the very crux of the issue with McCarthy is that he never produced a scintilla of proof to back up his own accusations.

I would have thought that a McCarthy fan would find that admirable, or would at least dismiss it with "I see that proof wasn't your point." You know, the same lame excuse granted to Joe.

" Mr. Evans researched the subject for six years and his conclusions are in black and white yet you insist on maintaining your ignorance. This is too much for my blood pressure. "

Suit yourself. Trying to defend a losing proposition can be stressful. Imagine how old Joe felt when people started demanding that he produce proof. Maybe we know since his health failed and he died young.

If Stan Evans in six years of study had ever discovered McCarthy's famous list it would have been big news and we'd all know about it. We'd know the names of the Communists subverting the State Department (at least other than five star general George Marshall whom McCarthy did name as being part of a treasonous conspiracy. Do you believe that McCarthy accusation?).

McCarthy claimed to have 57, 205, 10 names, take your pick, of Communist agents in the State Department. He made the claim, no one put the words in his mouth. He claimed this knowledge all on his own.

Whittaker Chambers wasn't afraid to name names. He outed Alger Hiss. Elizabeth Bentley wasn't afraid to name names. She accused Harry Dexter White and William Remington. How come Chambers and Bentley were able to name names of Communist agents and McCarthy never did? Is it because Chambers and Bentley were the real deal and McCarthy was a fraud?

If anybody proved useful to Communists it was McCarthy, because his behavior tainted the work of those who really were outing Communists. Useful idiots in the press only needed to give McCarthy all the publicity he wanted and he'd manage to do their work of discrediting investigations for them. And he played right into their hands.

[Pelham]

“No, you linked to an undocumented calumny of the senator’s speech. For actual documentation, read Evan’s book.”

By ‘undocumented calumny’ do you mean that McCarthy said 57 names and the printed version says 205?

Fine. I’ll go with 57 names. Name one.

[Jeff Chandler]

Go ahead and cling to your liberal fantasy. I'm done with you.

[No One Special]

Here’s an article by Evans that lists some names that McCarthy provided and info on what was found out about them:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2014/01/21/mccarthyism-by-the-numbers/

Not sure if any of these were on the list you’re discussing and am not sure if those names are even known.

Here is the list:

1 .Adler, Solomon
2. Aronson, James *
3. Barr, Joel
4. Belfrage, Cedric *
5. Bisson, T.A.
6. Carlisle, Lois
7. Chew Hong
8. Chi Chao-ting
9. Coe, V. Frank *
10. Coleman, Aaron
11. Currie, Lauchlin
12. Dolivet, Louis
13. Duran, Gustavo
14. Field, Frederick
15. Glasser, Harold *
16. Graze, Gerald
17. Graze, Stanley
18. Hanson, Haldore
19. Henderson, Donald *
20. Hyman, Harry *
21. Jaffe, Philip
22. Karr, David
23. Keeney, Mary Jane
24. Lattimore, Owen
25. Levine, Ruth *
26. Levitsky, Joseph *
27. Lovell, Leander
28. Mandel, William *
29. Miller, Robert
30. Mins, Leonard *
31. Moore (Gelfan), Harriet *
32. Moss, Annie L.
33. Neumann, Franz
34. Older, Andrew
35. Peress, Irving *
36. Posniak, Edward
37. Post, Richard
38. Remington, William
39. Rosinger, Lawrence *
40. Rothschild, Edward *
41. Sarant, Alfred
42. Smedley, Agnes
43. Snyder, Samuel *
44. Stein, Guenther
45. Stern, Bernhard *
46. Taylor, William H.
47. Ullmann, Marcel *
48. Wales, Nym
49. Weintraub, David
50. Weltfish, Gene *

An asterisk indicates “[taking] the Fifth Amendment as to Communist/ Soviet activity-affiliation”

[Pelham]

It's important to pay close attention to the way that Stan Evans described this list in his Breitbart piece:

Suspects named by McCarthy, his aides, or before his committee; identified in sworn testimony, FBI archives, or other official security records as Communists or Soviet agents; or took the Fifth Amendment when asked about such matters.

This is a list of people exposed as Communists by people other than McCarthy, such as Chambers and Bentley and other FBI sources. This isn't McCarthy offering up the list of names that he claimed to have in the Wheeling speech that made him a national figure.

That McCarthy list is a big deal because the entire country was rightfully concerned that the State Department had a large number of known Soviet agents and spies in it. At least it did if McCarthy was telling the truth. McCarthy would have done national security a huge favor by exposing that list of Soviet spies. He didn't, and it's not because he suddenly decided to help them remain at large.

[Pelham]

“Go ahead and cling to your liberal fantasy. I’m done with you. “

Adhering to the rules of evidence isn’t ‘liberal’ or ‘conservative’. It’s just logic.

But trying to support a losing proposition by labeling your opponent is a sort of homage to the very technique that McCarthy made famous, so you do have that going for you. Not sure it’s an asset but it is ironic.