Heroin problem: 'We're not going to arrest our way out of this'

The Dispatch / The Rock Island Argus [IL] ^ | January 18, 2015 | Rachel Warmke

[gdani]

The study averaged state-specific data over two-year periods. It found that, for the 2011-2012 period, 10.4 percent of Colorado residents....

Marijuana did not become legal in Colorado until December 2012.

In any event, how exactly does the Government (or anyone else) get reliable figures on how much of any kind of illegal, underground activity occurs?

[DiogenesLamp]

Nobody's promoting heroin, liar.

*YOU* are promoting heroin, as well as the legalization of all drugs.

[outpostinmass2]

Thanks I will read it. I would also like you to cite the Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act of 1938.

[outpostinmass2]

In any event, how exactly does the Government (or anyone else) get reliable figures on how much of any kind of illegal, underground activity occurs?

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Methodologies are cited in the report.

[morphing libertarian]

don’t take up a collection just yet. Heroin deaths a year 6000+, prescription analgesics 16,000+

[ConservingFreedom]

Singapore itself seems less gung-ho about the success of its current drug policies than some FReepers:

'Singapore — The Government will be convening a taskforce to come up with new approaches to tackle Singapore’s drug problem.

'Co-chaired by Senior Minister of State for Home Affairs Masagos Zulkifli and Minister of State for Education Sim Ann, the taskforce will comprise representatives from Government agencies and community partners.

'Mr Masagos said: “The objective of this taskforce is to be pre-emptive, to nip this problem in the bud, approach it to discourage and deter young people from taking drugs. Drawing on the work done from the Taskforce on Drugs, which I had chaired in 2011, I will consider the entire range of measures, including preventive education to detection, enforcement, counselling and rehabilitation.”

'UPWARD TREND IN DRUG ABUSE

'Mr Masagos was speaking at an event to thank volunteers and donors of the Singapore Anti-Narcotics Association (SANA) yesterday (Nov 7).

'He said the upward trend in the number of drug abusers arrested has continued since 2006 and that drug abuse among those below the age of 30 is one concern.' - http://www.todayonline.com/singapore/new-taskforce-fight-drug-abuse-singapore

And that approach has not succeeded in Indonesia (so why would it work here):

' APAIC reviewed drug use in Indonesia and found the following; between 2006 and 2010 the use of meth, barbiturates, heroin, and cannabis resin increased, while the use of ecstasy and cocaine remained about the same. APAIC also found that domestic production of meth and ecstasy is on the rise. Evidently the death penalty and decades long prison sentences are not deterring drug users or drug dealers.' - http://reason.com/blog/2012/05/30/you-can-sometimes-reduce-drug-use-if-you

[DiogenesLamp]

The War on (Some) Drugs has worked so well up to this point....

Yes it has, it has reliably kept usage down around 2% for 100 years, instead of letting it grow steadily as is NORMAL for drug addiction in a country that has legal drugs. Here is an example.

No increase in addiction in 100 years is an astonishing level of success, but some people are so STUPID as to believe that not wiping out *ALL* usage makes it a failure.

These people are simpleminded idiots who have no conception of how REALITY works. They live in a dream world utopia of absolutes that simply don't occur in the real world.

[Lurker]

“I will read it.”

Oh by all means please do. Especially considering the fact that this forum is dedicated to a return to Constitutional governance and drastically reducing the size, power, and scope of the Feds. It would only be polite to have some basic grasp of the document in question. Don’t you think?

After you do that we can have an adult discussion as to whether or not the Act you cited squares with it or not.

L

[DiogenesLamp]

Just like the War on Poverty.

No, much better. The ranks of the poor continue to grow, but drug addicts have been kept at ~ 2% for 100 years!!!!!

That is a FANTASTIC level of success when the NORMAL CONDITION is constant growth, like this:

[outpostinmass2]

I think you mean article I section 8? There is no article II section 8

[ConservingFreedom]

grow steadily as is NORMAL for drug addiction in a country that has legal drugs.

One example proves nothing about what's "normal". A counterexample is the absence of anti-drug laws - as you have agreed was the case - in the first 150 years or so of U.S. history.

[stephenjohnbanker]

What percentage of people in Singapore use illegal drugs? I’ll bet it is miniscule compared to the US.

[outpostinmass2]

“I will read it.”

Oh by all means please do. Especially considering the fact that this forum is dedicated to a return to Constitutional governance and drastically reducing the size, power, and scope of the Feds. It would only be polite to have some basic grasp of the document in question. Don’t you think?

After you do that we can have an adult discussion as to whether or not the Act you cited squares with it or not.

L

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I think you need to go back and read the Constitution. Article 2 section 8 doesn’t exist.

[BillM]

The scale of their problem is tiny compared to USA.

[apoliticalone]

I agree.

The war on drugs (and war on terror for that matter) have become a major profit center for DHS and DOJ etc. and serve as a means to change policy and take away rights that would never be tolerated by the people.

We tried the WOD for 50 years and it hasn’t worked. Time to start looking for new solutions. The government always jumps off the deep end with their BS incompetent comprehensive solutions. They need to implement pilot programs as businesses do and then start refining what works.

Hollywood and media are experts at propaganda. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torches_of_Freedom They rigged the system to convince women to smoke through their “torches of freedom”. Except most of their propaganda has destroyed family values and society. But given their power to convince they could easily make drugs not cool, especially to youth.

[Lurker]

Indeed I do. Sorry, fat fingers on a small keyboard.

Article 1, Section 8.

Then scroll on down to the 10th Amendment.

Then get back to me.

[DiogenesLamp]

Not much downside to it if you apply a bit of logic.

And a hell of a lot of wishful thinking and Fantasy. You are using the same sort of logic that all the Liberal utopians use to explain how their communism will work out great for everyone.

But just like with communism, we have REAL WORLD EXAMPLES of what happens when your ideas are tried in practice. This is what happened when you idea was tried in Switzerland.

“The strange scene has been a fixture in Zurich for several years, tolerated by city officials who are convinced that drug use should be regarded as a sickness rather than a crime. Social and medical workers estimate that about 300 to 400 heavy drug users live in the park without shelter, toilets or showers, and that as many as 3,000 others pass through daily to buy and use drugs………..the midway of the grotesque carnival is a concrete path along the edge of the Limmat River, lined with makeshift counters covered with neatly arranged spoons, bottles of water and paper cups bristling with slender, disposable syringes. The crowd thickens as night falls and drug hustlers work their way through the sea of bodies clogging the path, calling out ''Sugar, sugar, fine sugar!'' when they mean heroin, and ''Cokay, cokay!'' for cocaine……..the other night, three men crouched under a park lamppost, dividing a white powdery pancake of heroin with a Swiss Army knife. Next to them, a woman lay in the dirt in a stupor. Four or five men were intensely working needles into their arms. A woman in a striped sweater probed for veins in one hand, blood streaming down her fingers, as a woman in leather pants and stained blouse wobbled past, a bloody syringe dangling from her neck.”

It was an utter disaster. Switzerland called it off.

[outpostinmass2]

Indeed I do. Sorry, fat fingers on a small keyboard.

Article 1, Section 8.

Then scroll on down to the 10th Amendment.

Then get back to me.

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ok thanks, How are you making out with the 1938 Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act?

[DiogenesLamp]

You're so much wiser than us unwashed masses - please run our lives for us.

Most people can manage to run their lives, but i'm convinced that everyone else would be better off if you were in a locked cell.

[Lurker]

We don’t live in Switzerland. Nor does Switzerland have our Constitution.

Now if you want to pass an Amendment to the Constitution to regulate these substances then by all means have at it. You know, like we did with alcohol a few decades back.

Prohibition went so swimmingly well we still have it. Oh wait, we don’t.

Why is that?

Got your move to Singapore booked yet? I’d think you’d be frightfully busy making all your travel and living arrangements by now.

L