Deputy Prime Minister Tomasz Siemoniak in Berlin (discussing EU military)

Poland Ministry of National Defense ^ | 10/29/2014

[Olog-hai]

On Wednesday, October 29^th, the Defense Minister was a honorary guest of Bundeswehr commanding cadre and management conference chaired by German Defense Minister Ursula von der Leyen.

“A strong democratic Europe needs a strong Germany and strong Poland. The power does not only mean economic power, economic links. It is not only about certainty that our values are right. Power also includes ability of defense, it is also a military power, the power of Bundeswehr and Polish Armed Forces,” said Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Defense Tomasz Siemoniak in Berlin. […]

Moreover, Defense Ministers talked about the situation in Ukraine, indicating the need to look for solutions that would allow them to stop the violence. …

[wetphoenix]

~“A strong democratic Europe needs a strong Germany and strong Poland. The power does not only mean economic power, economic links. It is not only about certainty that our values are right. Power also includes ability of defense, it is also a military power, the power of Bundeswehr and Polish Armed Forces,”~

ROLFMAO. Poland like to whine about German or Russian empires but their self-perception is something:)

[mac_truck]

Meanwhile in Norway.... King Harald Commemorates WW2 liberation of Finnmark

[Olog-hai]

Well, thanks to liberal regimes in the USA and “reset buttons”, they’re stuck between the two.

[wetphoenix]

~Well, thanks to liberal regimes in the USA and “reset buttons”, they’re stuck between the two.~

How is simple geography affected by liberal regimes and either buttons?

[Olog-hai]

What with respect of geography applies here?

[wetphoenix]

~they’re stuck between the two~

Where do you suggest to move Poland?

[Olog-hai]

Got nothing to do with moving Poland. More to do with imperialist revanchism on the parts of Germany and Russia, which the USA was supposed to keep at bay. Of course, Obama killed the last vestiges of Pax Americana, so now we have Bellum Europaeorum again.

[Grzegorz 246]

They should drop that PC nonsense and stop pretending that those asiatic hordes liberated anything.

[mac_truck]

asiatic hordes

You're quite the phrenologist aren't you?

Good luck with that Chuck.

[wetphoenix]

There is a kind of butt-hurt for them to realize that Norway, Finland, Austria were liberated by the Soviets and were later left alone as far as the Soviets understood that said societies are actively uninterested in communism and being a part of East block particularly.

It puts a big crack on mainstream Polish narrative of ‘asiatic hordes’ who single-handedly brought them troubles while they were just an innocent victims.

Modern Poles opted to ignore how utterly leftist their grandparents were at the end of WWII, enabling communist takeover.

It is much more comfortable to quote Patton, solely blaming ‘asiatic hordes’ for their own past choices and related troubles without mentioning their own communists despite the fact there were more than just crowd of them.

Bottom line is Polish political class were a butt kissers all the way but at the same time they are focused to look mean and pose as a victims of forces one allegedly unable to resist.

That is why everytime they think certain butt is not worth kissing anymore due to a shift in operational environment, they immediately claim they were forced to, right before proceeding to the next, more promising butt.

W.Churchill actually had a definition for such people.

[gadrael]

There is a kind of butt-hurt for them to realize that Norway, Finland, Austria were liberated by the Soviets and were later left alone as far as the Soviets understood that said societies are actively uninterested in communism and being a part of East block particularly.

You definitely should read about Yalta, Tehran and Potsdam.

Modern Poles opted to ignore how utterly leftist their grandparents were at the end of WWII, enabling communist takeover.

Yeah, they were so utterly leftist that Soviets had to keep hundreds thousands of their soldiers in Poland all that time...

[wetphoenix]

~You definitely should read about Yalta, Tehran and Potsdam. ~

Yes, I know all of the above. It doesn’t hurt my point at all, actually just opposite.
It means that Soviet activity in Europe was according to treaties, in which US and Britain were participants.
It actually makes their actions more legitimate than of the Clinton’s and Obummer’s regimes regarding Yugoslavia and Middle East.

~Yeah, they were so utterly leftist that Soviets had to keep hundreds thousands of their soldiers in Poland all that time...~

So what? United States has troops in many countries and it is not to suppress locals. Would you argue presence of local commies in Poland? You literally make no sense this way.
And you probably forgot that it was Polish 2nd Army manned by nearly 30 thousand Polish men which spearheaded the Warsaw pact invasion of Czechoslovakia. Oh, wait...I said Warsaw Pact. What country has a capital named like that?

[Grzegorz 246]

LOL ! Without us, you would have dragged your genocidal syphilis to Elbe (or Rhine or even Meuse) +20 years earlier. With millions of additional victims.

[gadrael]

It means that Soviet activity in Europe was according to treaties, in which US and Britain were participants.

It only means that countries like Poland had nothing to say about their own future after a war.

So what? United States has troops in many countries and it is not to suppress locals. Would you argue presence of local commies in Poland? You literally make no sense this way.

Tens of thousands of polish officers were murdered by Soviets, millions of poles died during war, another tens of thousands couldn't return after fighting on west front. There weren't much people left in poland who could oppose red army and their puppets. But despite of all that, many Poles were fighting against commies many years after the war. It were not so easy to oppose communism, when you could be imprisoned or killed without any sentence by commies backed by hundreds thousands of soviet guns, and yet poles managed to destroy this system.

If anyone is interested in objective look at this (well.. as objective as Englishman can be) , I really recommend "God's Playground" by Norman Davies, there is very interesting part about second war and communism in Poland.