So (not unkindly, my charmer) why don't you take your teeth and toenails someplace where they'll really appreciate them?
Posted on 10/28/2014 2:18:29 PM PDT by edwinland
Of all the columns I imagined writing when I started out at this job, it’s safe to say that Sunday’s piece, in which I suggested that conservative Catholics should “resist” their pope if he seems intent on leading the church off a doctrinal precipice, was not one of them. So it’s worth saying something briefly about my own personal religious perspective on the church to which I belong.
I am a Catholic for various contingent reasons (this is as true of converts as of anyone else), but on a conscious level it’s because I am a mostly-faithful Christian who is mostly convinced that Roman Catholicism is the expression of Christianity that has kept faith most fully with the early church and the words of Jesus of Nazareth... A point that Cardinal George Pell[made] ... — that the search for authority in Christianity began not with pre-emptive submission to an established hierarchy, but with early Christians who “wanted to know whether the teachings of their bishops and priests were in conformity with what Christ taught” — is crucial to my own understanding of the reasons to be Catholic: I believe in papal authority, the value of the papal office, because I think that office has played a demonstrable role in maintaining the faith’s continuity, coherence and fidelity across two thousand years of human history. It’s that role and that record, complicated and checkered as it is, that makes the doctrine of papal infallibility plausible to me ... and indeed if you asked me to write a long defense of “infallibility” as a concept I’m sure I’d end up caveating it ... The language that I think the historical record supports is more like impressive continuity on the most important questions.
One of those important questions is the nature of marriage ...
(Excerpt) Read more at douthat.blogs.nytimes.com ...
So what about all that saving teeth and toenails from dead people?
What the hell is up with that?
Well, help us with Matt. 5:48. "You are to be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect."
I could tell you but it would be better to google it from an authentic Catholic source and know the Full truth.
There is actually reasoned logic and biblical stuff behind it!
It goes back to Roman times when the martyrs would die glorious deaths for Christ and they would gather up the remains. The remains of St. Ignatius when he was killed in the arena around 100 A.D., “were conveyed to Antioch and wrapped in linen, an inestimable treasure left to the holy Church by the grace which was in the martyr.”
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0123.htm
Sorry if it offends your sensibilities, but frankly I think those Christians living under threat of the lions ought to be granted a bit of leeway by we who are too “sophisticated” for such things.
So (not unkindly, my charmer) why don't you take your teeth and toenails someplace where they'll really appreciate them?
What the [] is up with that?
I don't think Ross Douthat is purporting to make a complete defense of the Catholic Church and all of its practices in one blog post, but since you asked, I googled up your question and found this very helpful explanation of the Christian practice of saving the bones of saints and martyrs:
http://www.catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contributions/keeping-relics-in-perspective.html
A few quotes fromt he article that I found interesting:
"but when the man came into contact with the bones of Elisha, he came back to life and rose to his feet." (II Kgs 13:20-21),
"Meanwhile, God worked extraordinary miracles at the hands of Paul. When handkerchiefs or cloths which had touched his skin were applied to the sick, their diseases were cured and evil spirits departed from them" (Acts 19:11-12)
"We took up the bones, which are more valuable than precious stones and finer than refined gold, and laid them in a suitable place, where the Lord will permit us to gather ourselves together, as we are able, in gladness and joy, and to celebrate the birthday of his martyrdom." (A letter by the faithful of the Church in Smyrna concerning the death of St. Polycarp, A.D. 156)
I admire and esteem the Orthodox Churh --- and they are so close to us, our dearest kin for sure -- and yet they caved on divorce/remarriage and, evidently, contraception, a long time ago. Gave in at just those points where the secular culture was pressing hardest.
We don't always practice what we preach. Fersure. But if only we preached what we believe!
Thank you, Ross Douthat, preach on.
If you can find a link, I’d love it. I have a relic of St. Gerard which horrifies various freepers here. I’m fairly ignorant of the logical and biblical reasoning behind it.
Sorry, but saving bits of dead people is just freaky.
Probably unsanitary too. Just ick.
“...Roman Catholicism is the expression of Christianity that has kept faith most fully with the early church and the words of Jesus of Nazareth”
Statements like this insults our intelligence. We’ve all got history books, for heaven’s sake. We all know about the thousands, some would say millions, burned alive at the stake by Roman Catholicism in cahoots with various emperors in the middle ages.
Where, pray tell, did Jesus of Nazareth or the early church, in cahoots with secular kings, have people killed who didn’t agree with them?
Only one of many things we could name, which the RCC does NOT keep faith with Christ and the early church.
Not like when that dead guy's body was chucked in Prophet Elisha's grave and he came back to life again.(LINK)
What did Christ say? Take the log out of your own eye before you criticize the speck in someone else's eye?
Answer these, and then we can talk about teeth and toenails: Biblical Absurdities
Ok.
You run ahead with necropolitic mess.
I’m not tossing anybody into any bone pits or saving their
fingers or noses or ears. I do collect odd stuff so I’m not
being judgmental, just stating my preferences.
I need not worry about myself or seek perfection before I ask questions.
Millions?
Jewish historian Steven Katz remarked on the Medieval Inquisition that "in its entirety, the thirteenth and fourteenth century Inquisition put very few people to death and sent few people to prison; 90 percent of its sentences were canonical penances" (The Holocaust in Historical Context, 1994).
During the high point of the Spanish Inquisition from 1478-1530 AD, scholars found that approximately 1,500-2,000 people were found guilty. From that point forward, there are exact records available of all "guilty" sentences which amounted to 775 executions. In the full 200 years of the Spanish Inquisition, less than 1% of the population had any contact with it, people outside of the major cities didn't even know about it.
If we add the figures, we find that the entire Inquisition of 500 years, caused about 6,000 deaths. These atrocities are completely inexcusable. These numbers are however, a far cry from the those used in the popular press by people who are always looking to destroy the Church. This is about one-fifth of the number of war related deaths that have occurred in Afghanistan and Iraq in just the first 2 years of 2003-2005.
The Inquisition killed FAR fewer people than the other contemporary forms of justice,i.e.e. strictly secular courts. SO much so that historian Thomas Malden, who has studied the records (and detailed records do exist) says that people with charges against them in secular courts often tried to get their cases transferred to an ecclesiastical court, which actually had standards of procedural due process, and were far more likely to acquit.
As for the Medieval Inquisition. (1231-1400 AD) --- as distinct from the Spanish Inquisition ---a broad range of scholars, many of whom were not Catholic, have carefully studied the records, and calculate approximately 2,000 people died in a little less than 200 years. That averages to a little more than 10 per year.
The execution of just one person for reasons of conscience and conviction is a terrible and shameful thing: terrible, shameful, damnable.
I'm just giving the historic perspective. If you doubt it, look into it yourself. There's lots of scholarship out there.
Woooo. Bones. Biblical.
But apparently not biblical doctrinally for Christians...How many thousands of years ago did that happen...And when's the last time someone came back from the dead by touching a pope's robe???
Is that what you did? Asked innocent questions? That's it?
LOL
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