Posted on 08/13/2014 11:15:02 AM PDT by Jim Robinson
> If Obama can selectively enforce federal law, do you think that Texas would not reply with the same in selectively enforcing its own “regulations?>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yep. Thats what happens in Texas. Go to Helotes and ask them.
I certainly hope not; I'm of the opinion that he's either a moral coward, afraid to use his lawful authority to its fullest, or he's in on it
.
The latter is not ruled out because he called up the national guard; but it could well be that this force multiplier
-Mission is kabuki designed to (a) convince the population that he's doing something
, (b) illustrate to other governors the ineffectiveness of using their power, and/or (c) give himself a political boost so he may ride to the White House
.
I still predict that the TNG will be packin’.
You do realize that you just replied to something you yourself said, right?
Emphasis is required.
Let me put it another way, in terms of consequences, what do you think will be the consequence of a soldier on an observation mission not specifically authorized to use lethal force (and quite possibly having orders explicitly denying that authorization) should he fire on one of these invaders?
What would the political fallout be?
Would that political mess be such that commanders would strongly discourage its possibility?
Would that political fallout be enough to make NCOs hypersensitive to not obeying orders in this matter
even though such an order is highly likely to be illegal?
In short; what's your experience within National Guard organizations?
It’s a federal issue, until the feds shirk their duty as required under the constitution. If the state governments roll over and kiss the fed’s ass, then it’s up to the people closest to the situation to resolve the problem. If the government refuses to do their job, SHUT THEM OUT, AND TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS! And if they interfere, THROW THEM IN JAIL ALONG WITH ALL OF THEIR FELLOW CRIMINALS! If the political officers of your state refuse to do their job, as required by yoir state constitution, THROW THEM IN JAIL WITH THE REST THE CRIIMINALS!
What part of upholding and defending the constitution, that virtually every civil servant has sworn an oath to, don’t these idiots understand?
Violate that oath, and you WILL PAY THE PRICE! And that price will be your blood.
LOL.
Let the fallout chips fall where they may.
Wait and see.
Texans do not go to a gunfight without guns.The never have and never will, regardless of what laws and regulations are selectively enforced.
It is insofar as Art 4, Sec 4 is concerned, yes.
That, however, does not preclude it from being a state issue; to wit Art 4, Sec 4 says:
The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.The whole last half of that paragraph is all about state issues: Invasion, Domestic Violence, the application of the Legislature (or Executive if the Legislature is not available).
The States also have the duty to protect their citizens from invasion; it is often spelled out in State constitutions.
If the state governments roll over and kiss the fed’s ass, then it’s up to the people closest to the situation to resolve the problem.
I fully agree; the second biggest problem there is essentially a PR problem — if/when the citizens take into their own hands the power of the sword they will instantly be painted as evil, bad-guys, out-for-blood murderers, etc.
Tench Coxe said it best:
The power of the sword, say the minority…, is in the hands of Congress. My friends and countrymen, it is not so, for The powers of the sword are in the hands of the yeomanry of America from sixteen to sixty. The militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress has no power to disarm the militia. Their swords and every terrible implement of the soldier are the birthright of Americans. The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments but where, I trust in God, it will always remain, in the hands of the people.
— The Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788.
If the government refuses to do their job, SHUT THEM OUT, AND TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS! And if they interfere, THROW THEM IN JAIL ALONG WITH ALL OF THEIR FELLOW CRIMINALS!
Actually in this matter the proper punishment is for them to be hanged by the neck until dead
.
That is the proper punishment for Treason.
If the political officers of your state refuse to do their job, as required by your state constitution, THROW THEM IN JAIL WITH THE REST THE CRIIMINALS!
I agree.
What part of upholding and defending the constitution, that virtually every civil servant has sworn an oath to, don’t these idiots understand?
That is a very good question.
One thing that erodes it is the elevation of precedent above the level of Constitutional law, another is the aversion to accountability politicians develop.
Violate that oath, and you WILL PAY THE PRICE! And that price will be your blood.
Yes, it should be.
They're not going to a gunfight; they're going on an observation mission
.
That's the point you're failing to comprehend.
There's a reason for that: Texas is the Republican-party of the States.
By this I mean that they run on reputation that, if ever deserved, applies no longer. Just like the Republican-party paints itself as being for the Constitution, or for gun-rights, or for fiscal responsibility, or for governmental accountability yet do nothing in those areas, so too is the State of Texas.
This is Texas, and everyone will have a gun
and Texans arrested for open carry even of rifles used for hunting
are therefore completely compatible: the words and image presented is a facade and has nothing to do with the reality. This facade is used to soothe the population, convincing them to say I am free
even as they drag their chains behind them.
Sadly this is the new normal for America.
Summed up here.
It will be a gunfight.
Really?
Why do you think there will be departure from their “observe only” mission?
Why do you think there will be departure from their “observe only” mission?>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Why do you think Obama is creating the situation for them to be deployed in the first place?
Why had Obama been running weapons to the cartels through Fast and Furious?
Why has there been no accurate reporting on fire fights and sniping along the border from the Mexican side?
Why does the MSM or the Mecican media NOT report what is truly taking place along the border as it is reported here, and has been for over 7 years, getting worse?
Once you know what the TNG “observers” will face, you then have a genuine idea of what will happen.And the so called observers already know exactly what will happen.
http://www.txsg.state.tx.us/mexico-travel-policy-for-texas-military-forces.aspx
*********************************
Mexico Travel Policy for Texas Military Forces
AGTX
2009/02/22
MEXICO TRAVEL POLICY
The security situation in Mexico continues to be volatile and may pose a significant threat to members of the TXMF.
Effective 22 February 2009, all TXMF personnel who are in a Full-Time status (AGR, ADOS) and any who are in a paid military duty status (AT, IDT) are prohibited from travel to Mexico for discretionary or personal reasons.
This prohibition involves travel to all of Mexico, including popular tourist destinations. If there is some compelling reason that a person who fits the above parameters needs to travel to Mexico, they must submit a written request through their chain of command for exception to the TXMF Force Protection Office (J3). This request will be evaluated by the Force Protection Officer, and approved or disapproved in writing.
Traditional Guardsmen and other employees (not addressed above) are strongly encouraged to abide by this policy as well. However, if you elect not to follow the travel restrictions, personnel should very carefully review the full State Department travel alert and implement the cautionary practices recommended.
Below is an excerpt from the State Department Official Travel Alert in regards to Mexico. The full alert can be found at: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/pa/pa_3028.html
This policy is in effect until 1 April 2009. It will be reassessed every ten days thereafter.
Mexico
February 20, 2009
This Travel Alert updates security information for U.S. citizens traveling and living in Mexico. It supersedes the Travel Alert for Mexico dated October 15, 2008, and expires on August 20, 2009.
While millions of U.S. citizens safely visit Mexico each year (including thousands who cross the land border every day for study, tourism or business), violence in the country has increased recently. It is imperative that travelers understand the risks of travel to Mexico, how best to avoid dangerous situations, and whom to contact if one becomes a crime victim. Common-sense precautions such as visiting only legitimate business and tourist areas during daylight hours, and avoiding areas where prostitution and drug dealing might occur, can help ensure that travel to Mexico is safe and enjoyable.
A number of areas along the border are experiencing rapid growth in the rates of many types of crime. Robberies, homicides, petty thefts, and carjackings have all increased over the last year across Mexico generally, with notable spikes in Tijuana and northern Baja California. Ciudad Juarez, Tijuana and Nogales are among the cities which have recently experienced public shootouts during daylight hours in shopping centers and other public venues. Criminals have followed and harassed U.S. citizens traveling in their vehicles in border areas including Nuevo Laredo, Matamoros, and Tijuana.
The situation in Ciudad Juarez is of special concern. Mexican authorities report that more than 1,800 people have been killed in the city since January 2008. Additionally, this city of 1.6 million people experienced more than 17,000 car thefts and 1,650 carjackings in 2008. U.S. citizens should pay close attention to their surroundings while traveling in Ciudad Juarez, avoid isolated locations during late night and early morning hours, and remain alert to news reports. A recent series of muggings near the U.S. Consulate General in Ciudad Juarez targeted applicants for U.S. visas. Visa and other service seekers visiting the Consulate are encouraged to make arrangements to pay for those services using a non-cash method.
U.S. citizens are urged to be alert to safety and security concerns when visiting the border region. Criminals are armed with a wide array of sophisticated weapons. In some cases, assailants have worn full or partial police or military uniforms and have used vehicles that resemble police vehicles. While most crime victims are Mexican citizens, the uncertain security situation poses serious risks for U.S. citizens as well.
Obama didn't create the situation!
Exasperate and exacerbate: yes; create: no.
This went on during Bush, and during Clinton [IIRC]… and I would be surprised if it wasn't going on w/ Bush Sr.
Why had Obama been running weapons to the cartels through Fast and Furious?
IMO: PR, motivating pressure to clamp down on firearms, etc.
Why has there been no accurate reporting on fire fights and sniping along the border from the Mexican side?
That one I'm not sure.
One would think that being shot at
would qualify as exciting news
.
Why does the MSM or the Mecican media NOT report what is truly taking place along the border as it is reported here, and has been for over 7 years, getting worse?
Oh, it's been going on longer than 7 years.
Once you know what the TNG “observers” will face, you then have a genuine idea of what will happen. And the so called observers already know exactly what will happen.
You, sir, are obtuse.
Have you been in the military?
Do you know the sorts of politics therein?
Do you know about observer role missions?
Do you know about observer role missions with the National Guard?
What we are seeing in TX is political theater — the inclusion of loaded firearms introduces a huge liability in uncontrolled variables. Any shooting, once it gets out, is likely to spark a lot of public interest, that interest will blow the cover off this as a PR stunt. — It is therefore far, far better for the political elite if the NG is given the appearance of being armed. In fact we have confirmation of this from that general's own mouth:
Nichols said troops will be armed for their safety, but when asked if their weapons would be loaded would say only that ammunition would be in magazines.I know you aren't reading between the lines, but here's the reality: the ammo will be in magazines, but the magazines will not be issued to the soldiers (or easily accessible) OR if they are issued thereunto they will come with a ROE that effectively prevents engagement. How can I tell you this? Simple:
"That's about as far as I want to go because if the cartel folks understand what we can and can't do then they may take advantage of that," Nichols told The Associated Press.
That's about as far as I want to go because if the cartel folks understand what we can and can't do then they may take advantage of that— there's nothing that the cartels could take advantage of if it was just ammunition in magazines because that's what happens in an actual fight.
Secondly, personal experience: I was in the National Guard for nine years; I went to Iraq and did detainee ops, there I had clear directions and, essentially, if they weren't breaching the outer gate lethal force wasn't an option. (And that was literally a war zone.)
Again, what evidence do you have that this is going to be a gunfight?
All my experience tells me that this is a political stunt, and that observation means for display purposes only
.
Obama didn’t create the situation!>>>>>>>>>>>>
He started creating the situation from the very first few months of his first term, by tweaking the arms flow to the cartels under Fast and Furious, including Barrett .50 caliber sniper rifles. Its right out of the Saul Alinsky playbook, Rules for Radicals.
The fruition was Obama’s executive order allowing entry of non Mexican “children.” It purposefully drew tens of thousands of minors, creating a refugee situation at the border, now being used by criminals as cover, according to plan.This is because Congress refused to pass Obama’s “Dream Act” unamended.Therefor Obama’s policy is to punish America, expecially the red states, and then blame Congress for that punishment. Therefore Obama is impeachable, and if Conservatives gain control of the Senate this November, you can say goodbye to Obama early in 2015.
In totality, Obamas policy and his conduct has been to create instability and to punish his political enemies in both Arizona and Texas. This is demographic warfare about to become very much conventional warfare. Obama wants this to happen so he can declare martial law in every red state he can.
Everything Obama does is dedicated to creating social instability under a thin mask of plausible deniability, which almost everyone excepts. The fact is that Obama is not acting in good faith at all. That fact is dawning now on most of America.
You're working against yourself here; you admit the preexistence of the situation with by tweaking the arms flow to the cartels under Fast and Furious
I'm not saying he's not applying Rules for Radicals; I'm saying that he worsened an already-extant condition.
> The fruition was Obama’s executive order allowing entry of non Mexican “children.” It purposefully drew tens of thousands of minors, creating a refugee situation at the border, now being used by criminals as cover, according to plan.This is because Congress refused to pass Obama’s “Dream Act” unamended.Therefor Obama’s policy is to punish America, expecially the red states, and then blame Congress for that punishment. Therefore Obama is impeachable, and if Conservatives gain control of the Senate this November, you can say goodbye to Obama early in 2015.
Congress deserves a lot of blame — they have continually and consistently refused to attend to the border.Previous administrations
, too, deserve much blame.
This has been going on for a long time.
Note, I AM NOT DEFENDING OBAMA — his guilt is obvious; however, I reject that the guilt is only his, or only his administration's… it would be far more appropriate to say that the culture of Treason has become endemic to federal officialdom.
> In totality, Obamas policy and his conduct has been to create instability and to punish his political enemies in both Arizona and Texas. This is demographic warfare about to become very much conventional warfare. Obama wants this to happen so he can declare martial law in every red state he can.
>
> Everything Obama does is dedicated to creating social instability under a thin mask of plausible deniability, which almost everyone excepts. The fact is that Obama is not acting in good faith at all. That fact is dawning now on most of America.
I agree; his goals are treasonous. (So, too, are the Congress's and the Bureaucracy.)
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