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To: kabar

The fact that you can say with a straight face that taxes need to be raised to ‘save’ social security indicates you have no grasp of mathematics.

When the government collects the extra taxes, they will be immediately spent and the National Debt increased by that amount. All that does is reduce the perceived need to cut spending and create an even more enormous problem, albeit a few more years down the road. The problem gets bigger exponentially because the obligation to pay benefits grows with inflation, and there is no offsetting growth in assets to cover these costs. Then on top of that you add the 1% or so the bonds earn which is actually another increase in debt.

Social Security will collapse under every ‘fix’ except for privatization. Mathematical fact.


110 posted on 10/08/2013 1:35:02 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders
The fact that you can say with a straight face that taxes need to be raised to ‘save’ social security indicates you have no grasp of mathematics.

You can raise the payroll tax to such a level as to make SS solvent. It is pure mathematics. From the 2013 Social Security and Medicare Boards of Trustees Annual Reports

" Social Security’s total expenditures have exceeded non-interest income of its combined trust funds since 2010, and the Trustees estimate that Social Security cost will exceed non-interest income throughout the 75-year projection period. The deficit of non-interest income relative to cost was about $49 billion in 2010, $45 billion in 2011, and $55 billion in 2012. The Trustees project that this cash-flow deficit will average about $75 billion between 2013 and 2018 before rising steeply as income growth slows to the sustainable trend rate after the economic recovery is complete and the number of beneficiaries continues to grow at a substantially faster rate than the number of covered workers. Redemption of trust fund asset reserves by the General Fund of the Treasury will provide the resources needed to offset Social Security’s annual aggregate cash-flow deficits. Since the cash-flow deficit will be less than interest earnings through 2020, reserves of the combined trust funds measured in current dollars will continue to grow, but not by enough to prevent the ratio of reserves to one year’s projected cost (the combined trust fund ratio) from declining. (This ratio peaked in 2008, declined through 2012, and is expected to decline steadily in future years.) After 2020, Treasury will redeem trust fund asset reserves to the extent that program cost exceeds tax revenue and interest earnings until depletion of total trust fund reserves in 2033, the same year projected in last year’s Trustees Report. Thereafter, tax income would be sufficient to pay about three-quarters of scheduled benefits through 2087.

You can increase the payroll tax to make up the 25% shortfall. That is just a fact.

When the government collects the extra taxes, they will be immediately spent and the National Debt increased by that amount.

SS is a pay as you go program, i.e., today's workers pay the benefits for today's retirees. The payroll taxes collected go directly to the SSA, which uses them to pay benefits. If the amount collected is equal to the benefits paid, there is no increase in the national debt.

The government (read General Fund) has been using the SS "surplus" to borrow against for other purposes and provides interest bearing, non-market T-bills in return. The increase in the national debt has nothing to do with SS taxes.

Social Security will collapse under every ‘fix’ except for privatization. Mathematical fact.

Wrong. The 12.4% payroll tax (3.2% each for employee and employer) can be raised to cover the SS shortfall. I am not recommending that due to the harm it would cause the economy, but there is no doubt that mathematically, you can increase revenue to make SS sustainable. You could also reduce benefits to achieve the same effect.

114 posted on 10/08/2013 2:14:46 PM PDT by kabar
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