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Liberals and Spying
Townhall.com ^ | June 15, 2013 | John C. Goodman

Posted on 06/15/2013 4:50:28 AM PDT by Kaslin

Have you noticed that the revelation about the National Security Agency surveilling our phone calls, our email, our credit cards and other personal information is creating great divisions at both ends of the political spectrum?

It's also revealing that quite a few people have political beliefs that are hard to understand.

On the right, we have Sen. Lindsay Graham (R-SC) ardently defending the NSA's intelligence gathering practices. This is the same senator who opposed background checks for firearms on the theory that such intrusiveness would create a "slippery slope."

On the left, we have the New York Times outraged that its editorial board declared that President Obama has "lost all credibility" on the issue. This is the same newspaper that is perfectly willing to give the government complete control over your health insurance, your retirement pension, and many other aspects of your personal life.

A while back I wrote that conservatism and liberalism are not ideologies. They are sociologies. What's the difference?

An ideology is a set of coherent ideas. Socialism is an ideology. So is libertarianism. Suppose I told you that socialists believe the government should nationalize the steel industry and the auto industry. You would have no difficulty inferring what their position is on nationalizing the airline industry. Right? Suppose I told you that libertarians believe in a free market for tinker toys and ham sandwiches. You would have no difficulty inferring that they also believe in a free market for Rubik's Cubes.

Sociologies are different. They represent a set of ideas that are often incoherent. These ideas are likely to come together not because of reason but because of history or happenstance. Not only do the ideas not cohere; they may be completely contradictory.

Still, the fact that political beliefs are incoherent doesn't mean that we can't try to understand them. I'll take on liberalism and save conservatism for another day.

Consider Hollywood liberalism. Hollywood likes big government. It sees government as the protector of the little guy against the forces of selfish business interests and rapacious capitalism.

But when is the last time you saw a movie in which the head of the CIA, NSA or any other government intelligence agency was a likeable guy? Our intelligence agencies are almost always portrayed as amoral, if not downright immoral. Ditto for the missions of our spy agencies.

James Bond movies don't count. Those are the Brits. Hollywood just doesn't like it when American agents do the same things that James Bond does. The only film I can remember that even tries to give the CIA a fair shake would be Zero Dark Thirty, about the killing of Osama Bin Laden. Yet even in that movie I suspect few people left the theater feeling proud to be an American.

Of course, when we are talking about Barack Obama's CIA, the left goes schizophrenic. On the one hand their natural inclination is to defend (or apologize for) just about anything this administration does. On the other hand, few of them view the CIA as an agency that a truly liberal government would even allow. This has been a bad week over at MSNBC.

Hollywood's treatment of the intelligence services isn't that much different from its treatment of the armed services. When is the last time a movie portrayed American soldiers as good guys liberating people around the world? The Green Berets? Before that, you probably have to go back to World War II.

Of course, our guys looked good in Saving Private Ryan, but that movie was about World War II.

I think we're on a roll here, so let's continue. When is the last time you saw a Hollywood movie in which policemen were the good guys? I'm not talking about investigation shows like CSI. I'm talking about shows where guys go out on the beat and protect ordinary citizens from criminals. Dirty Harry? That was almost a half century ago, and even then it was condemned as a fascist movie.

Think about how much good the police do — especially for families who could never afford private security guards to protect themselves? Now think about how much harm the welfare state does. When is the last time you saw a movie in which representatives of the welfare state are portrayed as the bad guys? The last one I remember was A Thousand Clowns. But that was also about 50 years ago.

Here is the pattern that is emerging: The police, the army, and the intelligence services are the parts of government that are engaged in protecting our rights, at least that is the justification for their existence. Just about everything else the government does involves violating our rights.

When it comes right down to it, the left doesn't believe in individual rights. It wants government to do "good things." But rights stand in the way of doing good things.

The right to pursue your own happiness, for example, is nothing more than the right to be selfish in the standard liberal sociology. The institutions designed to protect rights — the police, the army and the intelligence services — are therefore designed to protect your right to be selfish.

The left has no sympathy for institutionalized selfishness unless it is their own selfishness that needs protecting (as reflected in freedom of speech and freedom of press). And unless they are defending Barack Obama.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: liberalideology; liberals; nsa; spying; surveillance

1 posted on 06/15/2013 4:50:28 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin

The left wants a totalitarian state which would have to include severely repressive measures against citizens, but not against the ruling elite.


2 posted on 06/15/2013 4:57:01 AM PDT by I want the USA back (If I Pi$$ed off just one liberal today my mission has been accomplished.)
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To: Kaslin

Excellent article...thanks, Kaslin!


3 posted on 06/15/2013 4:57:05 AM PDT by left that other site (You Shall Know the Truth, and the Truth Shall Set You Free...John 8:32)
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To: Kaslin

A lot of it is a sports team mentality as well. “It’s ok when our side does it” is how a lot of the populace treats their own side on issues. Not always, but you’ll see each side defend their own even when they do things that doesn’t fit what normally they’d want.


4 posted on 06/15/2013 5:04:30 AM PDT by Monty22002
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To: Monty22002
“It’s ok when our side does it”

That is terribly damaging to both sides.
5 posted on 06/15/2013 5:08:44 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Kaslin

The hard left was always paranoid about government surveillance because they didn’t want to get caught plotting their revolution. It’s still a knee-jerk reflex with them. I don’t think conservatives are particularly paranoid about it. We oppose it on principle, especially with the left, anti-liberty, folks in charge.

I realize that in wartime, and other national emergencies, extraordinary measures need to be taken, but big government types have a way of keeping us in a permanent state of war, and perpetuate the infringements on our freedom. If there is no convenient foreign enemy, they will find a domestic one, and if one of them is not available, they will declare war on a nebulous concept, like terror, or poverty, or hunger.


6 posted on 06/15/2013 5:14:16 AM PDT by Daveinyork
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To: Kaslin
Progressives really only care about "their" people. And when I say their people you may think, "oh minorities, women, and the downtrodden". Oh no, that's not how the left works. If you are a black or Hispanic conservative, a woman espousing the virtues of life, or a Republican that has fallen on hard times or made mistakes, liberals will have no use for them. Liberals only support those who will advance their agenda, even in the strange way Obama is.
7 posted on 06/15/2013 5:23:33 AM PDT by corlorde (forWARD of the state)
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To: corlorde

Progressives HATE minorities....Progressives are ELITISTS and ONLY like their kind......they just USE STUPID people RILED up to get what they want to stay in Power!!


8 posted on 06/15/2013 5:30:30 AM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion.....the HUMAN Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: Daveinyork

“The hard left was always paranoid about government surveillance because they didn’t want to get caught plotting their revolution.”

Too many people on the right simply refuse to believe that statement.

Regardless of how much information they have in front of their face, they simply refuse to believe it.

They believe, simply because they want to believe, there has to be another explanation and will endlessly search for another explanation ignoring what is right in font of their face.

Listen to how many people on the right say “some of my best friends are leftist, THAY would never do that”.

They actually convince themselves because their leftist friends would never advocate a revolution, NO leftist would.


9 posted on 06/15/2013 5:53:24 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: IMR 4350

I know this because I once was a hard leftist in my misquided youth. I learned a hard lesson about this at the Peoples’ Revolutionary Constitutional Convention, in 1971 in DC. The Black Panthers forced a reporter for an “underground” radio station to erase the tapes of his interviews. They wanted to take my camera, because they claimed the right to authorize all pictures. The camera had been a gift from my parents, a reactionary concept in their eyes. I managed to talk then out of taking the camera, but they took my film (pre-digital stone age). I lost the camera to a pickpocket later that day.

It was the point at which my path diverged from that of the hard left. It wasn’t evident at first, because a shifting of a degree or two in direction is nearly imperceptible at first, but after a few miles can result in a large difference in destination. When I realized that, I made a hard right turn.


10 posted on 06/15/2013 6:20:44 AM PDT by Daveinyork
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To: Daveinyork

The worst part is when all hell breaks loose they will act surprised as if they never had a clue what was taking place and want to know “why didn’t someone tell me and why didn’t someone didn’t stop it”.

They will even go so far as to tell people that tried to warn them “you didn’t know”.

One that is going to be bit in the ass is Rush and his comment “non-violent coup” and “I live in Realville” implying anyone that doesn’t believe it’s non-violent as he does is living in Kookville.

When the violence of the left can no longer be denied, Rush and everyone else on the right that are so much smarter than the rest of us will claim they were right because it never was violent before it just turned violent.


11 posted on 06/15/2013 6:59:46 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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