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To: dirtboy
the materialist neo-Darwinian conception of nature is almost certainly false

Absolutely! However, if the materialism is true there would be no way to know that it is true because Reason would then be invalid and merely the epiphenomenon of blind irrational forces i.e chemical reactions, eletromagnetic waves etc. Reason, in order to be valid, MUST be independent of nature. This was very clearly explained in C.S. Lewis's book "Miracles."

Clear thinking Atheists know this but just cannot give up on Atheism regardless of its glaring, in your face, falsity. So they throw tantrums instead.

7 posted on 03/24/2013 9:06:48 AM PDT by HerrBlucher (Praise to the Lord the Almighty the King of Creation)
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To: HerrBlucher
HerrBlucher (Praise to the Lord the Almighty the King of Creation)

Amen to your tagline. Seems apropos on this thread. Let the materialists argue among themselves. It "matters" not. Dust to dust.

9 posted on 03/24/2013 9:14:52 AM PDT by Albion Wilde (Liberalism: knowing you're better than everyone else because of your humility. -- Daniel Greenfield)
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To: HerrBlucher
Absolutely! However, if the materialism is true there would be no way to know that it is true because Reason would then be invalid and merely the epiphenomenon of blind irrational forces i.e chemical reactions, eletromagnetic waves etc. Reason, in order to be valid, MUST be independent of nature.

Ditto bump

15 posted on 03/24/2013 9:42:19 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas
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To: HerrBlucher

Thanks for posting the source of the materialism vs. reason paradox.


16 posted on 03/24/2013 9:47:10 AM PDT by Zeneta (No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn.)
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To: HerrBlucher
Clear thinking Atheists know this but just cannot give up on Atheism regardless of its glaring, in your face, falsity. So they throw tantrums instead.

I have never witnessed an atheist tantrum. On the other hand theist tantrums are on display in every interaction, as here: "...cannot give up on Atheism regardless of its glaring, in your face, falsity."

You think something is false, fine, but in no way is the non-theistic world view glaringly false. If it were, it would not have so many intelligent, considered adherents. If you think it is false, it is up to you to put forward some convincing arguments in support, otherwise it is nothing more than a figurative stamping of feet. And, as Nagel says, “there is really no reason to assume that the only alternative to an evolutionary explanation of everything is a religious one.”

Here is a real insight few on either side of the divide will find comfort in.

22 posted on 03/24/2013 11:34:22 AM PDT by John Valentine (Deep in the Heart of Texas)
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To: HerrBlucher
After correctly rejecting blind reductionism, you offer this unsupported conclusion: "Reason, in order to be valid, MUST be independent of nature."

Not so! Reason is and must be part of any necessary and sufficient definition of Nature.

Nature is far grander and more wonderful than your absurd caricature of it.

I find nothing whatsoever either original or compelling in your post.

31 posted on 03/24/2013 1:48:02 PM PDT by John Valentine (Deep in the Heart of Texas)
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