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To: ansel12
Women did want safety and security -- for their children -- but more women than men saw that security in marriage, the family, and religion. Then came the social and sexual revolution of the 1960s, spearheaded by men.

You seem like an older person. Do you really not remember the atmosphere of the Sixties? It wasn't women who were driving social transformation. Not at the beginning anyway. Nor did the original sexual revolution have very much to do with women's concerns. Nor was it women who were building and expanding the welfare state.

Once that work was done, once marriage had become a much shakier institution, women came to look for security in government programs, rather than in families that often were left high and dry by men's abandonment. Or so the story goes. In fact, even in the last elections more married women voted for Romney. It was single women who gave Obama his edge, and that was most likely a result of abortion and sexual politics, rather than economic or social policy. To be sure, most women aren't in favor of a significant rollback of federal power, but neither are most men.

There's a parallel between your attitude on this thread and your view of Catholics on other threads. White women, married women, churchgoing women, White Catholics, married Catholics, churchgoing Catholics all voted (so far as I know) for the Republicans in the last election. Neither the male-female or the Protestant-Catholic divide was as significant as you've maintained. For better or worse, race, marital status, and religious observance count for more.

Do women and Catholics trend more Democrat than men or Protestants do? It looks like it. But so what? Some groups will always tend a little more in one direction than other groups. It doesn't mean everyone in the group or the group as a whole is somehow depraved. You can ignore the whole group or you can try to win over individual voters within the group (the wiser course), but condemning the whole group and praising your own doesn't serve much purpose in politics.

Once upon a time groups that are the most Republican today, say Southern White Evangelicals, were very much on the outside, and very much trying to use political power to get things for themselves, voting for Bryan and Wilson and Roosevelt, enjoying all the pork that seniority in Congress brings. Now other groups think of themselves as outsiders and follow similar strategies. That changes over time. Maybe we can do things about it. Doing little superiority dances probably won't do much good.

Talk about the evils of women's suffrage is a lot like talk about the evils of direct election of Senators. People think if they could just correct that things would revert back to a better state of affairs. But the 17th Amendment, like the 19th (or the 16th) was as much a result of trends as a cause of them.

In an age that prided itself on its democracy and egalitarianism, a non-elected body would either lose power or be forced to consent to having its members directly elected by the public. In such an age the vote wasn't going to be confined forever to men. Between suffragists who would go to prison or die to achieve their ends and a broader public that didn't really care, the franchise was going to be extended to women.

So is society more feminized now than it once was? Sure. But that's more a result of larger trends, many of them set in motion by men. Women's suffrage is a result of those trends, not a cause of them. Once women got the vote they did contribute more to increasing federal power, but that's very much a recent trend, something that's happened over the last 30 years or so.

There's a parallel here in the arguments about the "greatest generation" and the Boomers and post-boomers. The GI generation (and its precursors) set into motion a welfare state for working men. Lately the welfare state and society as a whole have become more "feminized." You can complain about that, but it wasn't women or their influence that originally established the welfare state, just as it wasn't the 60s and post-60s generations that made government so powerful and domineering. Maybe that older welfare state was better than the current one or maybe it wasn't so different. But it wasn't something women built.

163 posted on 03/10/2013 11:53:05 AM PDT by x
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To: x
You really are a troll, and evidently a stalker as you continue to try to make this thread related to past threads in some strange personal vendetta.

Just discuss the topic at hand the female effect on politics, and leave out whatever personal baggage you are carrying.

Women created the most destructive movement in American history, the "womens's movement" to liberate women and to fight for everything that you bizarrely think is a man's movement. Women suddenly, in a matter of decades, changed America and turned politics into a permanent discussion and contest over women's issues and interests, which are in opposition to American ideals and freedoms and American/male concerns and goals.

Women led the charge in the social/sexual revolution, not men. It wasn't men promoting divorce and sexual liberation of females, and the end of gender roles and the destruction of the family, that was all the creation of the women's movement and the beginning of the gender gap in voting.

"In addition, advocates for no-fault divorce argued that the law should be changed to provide a straightforward procedure for ending a marriage, rather than forcing a couple who simply couldn't get along to choose between living together in "marital hell" or lying under oath in open court. The most prominent advocate of this position was feminist law professor Herma Hill Kay (who later became dean of UC Berkeley School of Law).
At its convention in 1947, the National Association of Women Lawyers (NAWL) voted to draft and promote a bill that would embody the ideal of no-fault divorce and describes its efforts to promote the passage of no-fault divorce laws as "the greatest project NAWL has ever undertaken.""

1965 Founders of NOW as the women's movement grew ever larger by decade, and came to totally deconstruct and restructure all of American society and concepts of marriage and family and law and government power and freedom, and every element of life, a deconstruction of civilization bursting forth as females found their footing within the power of the universal vote.
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164 posted on 03/10/2013 1:03:44 PM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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