Posted on 01/15/2013 7:01:58 AM PST by Conservaliberty
Gun control alone will not solve the complex problem of guns and extreme violence. We have an access problem. The mentally ill should never have access to guns.
Eight of the nine killers in mass shootings in the United States in 2012 had a history of mental illness or suffered from untreated mental illness. Their families, friends, classmates, teachers or coworkers knew something was wrong.
The mass murders (defined by the FBI as four or more murders during one incident) occurred across the country -- including one right here in Minneapolis -- and targeted schools, movie theaters, stores, religious facilities and businesses, leaving 72 dead and 74 wounded. Two of the killers used assault rifles, but seven used handguns. And seven of the nine had access to legally purchased guns.
Many have called for a ban on military-style weapons, large ammunition magazines and more. The nation should consider a comprehensive federal policy.
But gun control alone will not solve the complex problem of guns and extreme violence. We have an access problem. The mentally ill should never have access to guns.
Federal law already prohibits high-risk individuals from buying guns -- persons determined by a court to be "mentally ill and dangerous," felons, drug addicts, fugitives, illegal aliens, dishonorably discharged soldiers, those who have renounced U.S. citizenship, and domestic abusers all are disqualified from gun ownership. The National Criminal Instant Background Check System (NICS) assists law enforcement in identifying the disqualified.
(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...
Other recent articles posted to FR talk about how this is just a ploy to use mental illness as a ploy to take our guns. Not to mention, what about the families of mentally ill? So many people have harped on the mother of the Newtown shooter because she owned guns when her son had a mental illness.
Anyone remember that one case where they tried to hold the father of a bipolar (adult) son responsible because the son broke into his locked house--but the gun wasn't locked up?
You know, this sounds a lot like the mental hygiene stuff they tried in Germany a few decades ago...
I am NOT a second class citizen. Don't deny me my constitutional rights because I have an illness.
People who think that the democrats stand up for the disabled and whatnot are idiots.
Again, I am NOT a second class citizen. Don't take my rights, legislators. I should be able to defend myself like everyone else.
(at least I don't live in Minnesota)
Soon enough, wanting a gun will be considered a mental illness. Then, a revolver, or any weapon that uses a magazine will be considered an assault weapon.
The irony is that this can have the negative effect that those with mental illnesses will avoid getting help so they will not lose their ability to buy guns.
Alternatively certain mental illnesses without treatment will create a dangerous individual to others or themselves.
What happens when someone wants to classify PMS as mental???
Well said.
Do not disarm.
Funny how you asked that question. For the first time in almost two decades the nation’s psychiatrists are “updating” their guidebook (Diagnosic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) used to diagnose mental disorders. Among the most controversial proposed changes: Dropping certain familiar terms like Asperger’s disorder and dyslexia and calling frequent, severe temper tantrums a mental illness. If a temper tantrum is a mental disorder...PMS must be certifiable.
I agree with the poster. There is a movement afoot to denigrate a HUGE chunk of the citizenry and EXPAND the definition of mental illness. It is a ploy to remove 2nd amendment rights without changing the constitution. Considering that 1 out of every 5 Americans is prescribed anti-psychosis, anti-depression, or anti-anxiety drugs, 18% of all cops diagnosed with PTSD (and treated with the same meds) and the epidemic of “mental illness” in active duty troops (top reason for military hospitalizations are “mental illness” in nature)...this is a large percentage of folks easily disarmed via mental health screening when applying for purchase permit/Concealed Carry.
Mix all this with ObamaCare, forced online medical records registry, and the “Executive Pen,” it begins to stink worse than Al Roker’s undershorts.
You are exactly right. And I am getting very weary of those on the Right, setting up a false dichotomy between the stupidity of the Left's anti-gun position and the idea that increased scrutiny of the mentally "ill" is the best approach to solving the problem.
Wayne LaPierre (head of the NRA) has repeatedly called for "an active national database of the mentally ill." On the face of it, there is something reasonable about that. But the problem starts when you start to draw the line on what constitutes a severe enough psychological disorder to get someone listed in the database. Is it just the paranoid schizophrenic? How about people with other dissociative disorders, or an oppositionally defiant child, or perhaps just ADHD? Depression? Bi-polar? Generalized anxiety disorder? Maybe impulse control issues, say pyromania or intermittent explosive disorder? Perhaps a pathological gambler or an overeater wouldn't make the list, but those are similar kinds of impulse control issues.
The problem is that the government would look to the American Psychiatric Association for guidance. Those are the same folks who (under political pressure) decided to remove homosexual behavior from it's list of disorders, and who consider sexual re-assignment surgery to be a procedure that the state should pay for in the case of prisoners. Sadly the APA has become too politically correct, who is to say what they would recommend as a threshold disorder, sufficient to land someone in the database?
Even worse it the not-so-far-fetched possibility that the government will simply come up with their own list—in consultation with white-coated experts, of course. But when the government does it, real problems ensue. You are right, this does begin to sound like the mental hygiene programs in Germany. And we should never forget the approach that was taken in the old Soviet Union (that may not have been changed today).
A crime is a deviation from generally recognized standards of behavior frequently caused by mental disorder. Can there be diseases, nervous disorders among certain people in a Communist society? Evidently yes. If that is so, then there will also be offences, which are characteristic of people with abnormal minds. Of those who might start calling for opposition to Communism on this basis, we can say that clearly their mental state is not normal.--Nikita Kruschev
The Left is clearly using this so-called crisis as an excuse to go after guns. Don't think for a moment that they will not use is as a way to start down the road of marginalizing whole classes of people until it becomes possible to simply make dissent a mental illness.
“Funny how you asked that question. “
Yeah, I was only being a little smart, and living on the edge (PMS and all).
The comment that wanting a gun indicates you are mentally ill is not a joke. It is an extension of the (ill-) logic being used on us (and the uninformed).
Catch 22 (or maybe catch .45, if you prefer)
We don't have a gun problem. We have problems with some that are not treated for mental illness. We have a problem with repeat offenders ... lifelong criminals on the street. We have a problem with government being all things to all people while failing to deliver on its most basic missions.
Our small city lost a young woman last weekend to an ex-boyfried. He stalked her for over a year and she asked the police for protection. She was afraid for her life. He shot her and dumped her body along the highway. He needed mental health attention and she needed a gun of her own. So sad.
I worked around former Soviet Jewish Refugees years ago. I learned then the Soviets used to use Mental Illness as a political tool, do I dare say we history repeats itself ???
Is this a joke? Of course a bi-polar person shouldn’t own guns, just like a blind person shouldn’t be a bus driver.
Its pretty easy for wimmin to get restraining orders against Men now-a-days, and if he violates it he goes to jail.
That sort of behavior is not necessarily a mental illness even though he needs some sort of therapy.
Those with untreated schizophrenia for example hear voices, see things, believe the end of the world is near, believe that they are Satan and or God, think that others especially doctors want to kill them or remove their brains, that others are possessed by Satan,..... I have known more than one in my life and its not pretty.
The irony is that this can have the negative effect that those with mental illnesses will avoid getting help so they will not lose their ability to buy guns.
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Absolutely—I just thought about that too.
I appreciate your concerns. The problem is, many folks who are dangerously ill are not treated or reported. I don’t have an answer, but it is a serious issue. Take a look at many of the social media pages of these killers—they are not just mentally ill, they are criminally insane.
Unfortunately, the gatekeepers are not only part of the problem, they are the problem. They are so far from moral balance that they can no longer discriminate between illness and outright evil.
“Eight of the nine killers in mass shootings in the United States in 2012 had a history of mental illness or suffered from untreated mental illness.”
And the ninth was perfectly sane?!?
Perhaps they shouldn’t, but they have an inherent, God-given right to do so, if they so choose.
Exactly. That is the only reason that Leftists will even entertain the idea - they consider real mental illness to be a career enhancer, but would love to use "medicine" to compromise our Freedom.
Not all mental health diagnoses are raving lunatics. Some people have every day issues and function just fine.
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