Posted on 12/29/2012 7:44:09 AM PST by Hojczyk
Barring a last-minute breakthrough, taxes will go up for every U.S. taxpayer on Jan. 1 — and that’s a development conservatives should welcome.
Don’t get me wrong: It would be better not to raise taxes on anyone, pursue pro-growth tax reform and cut the size of government instead. But that’s not what the American people voted to do last month. Americans cast their ballots for big government.
Now it’s time to pay for it.
Until now, the growth of government under President Obama has not hit the pocketbooks of most Americans. During Obama’s first term, federal spending grew to more than 24 percent of GDP — the highest it has been since 1946. Yet almost no one in the country (except smokers and those who frequent indoor tanning salons) saw their taxes rise. Quite the opposite: 160 million Americans saw their payroll taxes reduced from 6.2 to 4.2 percent.
How can we expect people to care about the growth of government if it doesn’t cost them anything?
Instead of paying for the current miasma of spending, we’ve been borrowing the money from our children and grandchildren. The national debt has grown by nearly $6 trillion in the four years since Obama took office. That generational theft cannot continue. We must not keep financing big government by passing the bills on to the next generation. Ideally, we would stop the spending binge and live within our means. But if the nation is not up to that, then we should all pitch in and pay for it — all of us.
Until then, Republicans need to stop protecting Americans from the consequences of their decisions to elect profligate politicians.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
Bob, raising tax rates DECREASES govt revenue....This is about class warfare not raising revenue, you fell into the trap again.
“So pray tell BobL now that we’re in the “mooching” class and no longer young enough to work what is YOUR solution? Put us out on the street and put us on another form of WELFARE...or have our kids take us in...or move back in with our parents...wait! They’re all DEAD except my 86 year old mother who has dementia and I take care of her.”
Assuming that your kids are still around, perhaps they should help out, as opposed to my kids, who already have me and the misses to deal with, in the not-so-far future.
“If you think doing away with SS and Medicare and having workers save for their own retirement, think again. In this economy do you really think that people are going to be able to do it?”
I agree, they won’t. They aren’t doing it now, and there’s no reason to think they will in the future. So we go after their kids and have them be the primary providers. If they can’t, then the government. That would bring these programs back into balance overnight. I know way too many elderly people that “don’t want to be a burden” to their children - so they are, instead, a burden to my children and their future.
So let’s start by bring the family back in. Shutting them out in 1933 was one of the biggest mistakes ever made by this country and it still may cost us our freedom if we don’t change that, and QUICKLY.
“Uh I don’t feel like being a slave RIGHT NOW. Not my debt and I will not keep working as hard as I do if my taxes are jacked up.”
No, you’re not a slave because you’re essentially getting a FREE RIDE from the government, just like myself. The problem is that the debt from the free ride is being piled on to my kids, and I don’t think they deserve it.
When you figure your taxes this year, double that number, and you will have an idea of what you should be paying, given the level of services this government is now providing. You will also see just how much debt you’ve dumped on the next generation...same amount.
“Bob, raising tax rates DECREASES govt revenue....This is about class warfare not raising revenue, you fell into the trap again.”
Not necessarily. If taxes are raised on the deadbeats, they WILL pay them, and the impact to economic activity will be minimal (i.e., less plasmas, Air Jordans, lottery tickets, and cigarettes). The poor just have to live without as many luxuries.
If taxes are raised on the wealthy, then I agree, it slows down activity, and likely won’t increase revenue - and may actually decrease revenue.
So I’d like to see the deadbeats have some skin in the game, for it will, FINALLY, teach them a lesson about voting for more goodies. I’m sick of protecting them from the consequences of their votes.
By the way, sorry about Michigan becoming Right-to-Work, that’s got to really sting...but those things happen once in a while.
No matter what happens I think conservatives need to focus on pulling all their money and support from people that supported Obama and Dems. Even after the election I saw my church continue to shower Obama voters with gifts and food for Thanksgiving/Christmas.
I keep waiting for some Republican to make the point that devaluation caused by inflation is a sneaky tax that hurts the poor more than the rich. A can of Heinz beans that cost $1.49 18 months ago became 1.99 six months ago, and is now 2.19. If that can of beans is typical, that’s inflation (sneaky tax) of ~52.3%
I know, numbers numbers, and thinking. Too much info for many Americans these days.
There’s are two more options:
1. Destroy the currency. (pay through inflation).
2. Grow the economy.
If we had a sane government, they would be trying to grow the economy. Every person who moves from welfare to working becomes a tax payer instead of a tax consumer.
I don’t know why this is so hard for the American people to understand.
About 15% of the population voted for bigger government. About 14% voted against it. That leaves about 70% of the population who didn’t speak up. Of course a good number of that 70% is underage and couldn’t vote (unless for Democraps) in the election. How can one consider 15% of anything a “mandate”?
‘No matter what happens I think conservatives need to focus on pulling all their money and support from people that supported Obama and Dems. Even after the election I saw my church continue to shower Obama voters with gifts and food for Thanksgiving/Christmas.”
That’s not unreasonable. If they would be neutral while accepting our gifts, that would be one thing. But they voted in huge numbers, over 100% in some areas, for Obama. We really don’t owe them anything.
Military “pensions” are differed pay. In 1964 I was paid $76/month, working 14 hour days, and a minimum wage person was getting about $170 month for 40 hour work weeks. I was also exposed to hazardous chemicals and forms of radiation, and had very primitive berthing and living environment. I did this voluntarily because of written and verbal promises of receiving compensation later in life. This was a very mature form of thinking and behavior, being willing to endure sacrifice while putting off gratification ‘till much later. This is way different from someone demanding compensation because an ancestor was enslaved five generations back or because they are just lazy.
When I reenlisted, I was ridiculed by some people for being a coward and being lazy. I was being wise beyond my years.
I’m staying clear of the military pension end of this. I simply don’t know enough to comment. If we can clean up Social Security and Medicare (i.e., turn them into formal welfare programs...from the informal welfare programs they now are), I would be THRILLED, and so would my kids.
I’m staying clear of the military pension end of this. I simply don’t know enough to comment. If we can clean up Social Security and Medicare (i.e., turn them into formal welfare programs...from the informal welfare programs they now are), I would be THRILLED, and so would my kids.
I’m not sure that we disagree on much, here. My point is that the
Demos should be pressured into putting their money where their
mouth is. History tells us Demos buy votes with goodies they pro-
vide thru taxes they secure from some of the same people they
are providing the goodies to. They ‘buy your vote with your money’,
if you will, while they claim to be the friend of the “hard working
families” of the middle class. I say that if they are such great
advocates of the middle class they should have no problem with
signing on to a promise not to raise taxes on them. Let us see
whether or not the Demo pols actually believe that taxing the
wealthy only will solve the economic issues of our time.
Are you pullin’ my leg? Do you really expect your kids to take care of you and your wife? Do you mean you will give your SS and Medicare back to the gooberment that forcefully took it for all your working years? Our kids and their spouses both work and live hand to mouth but do contribute to retirement accounts for their future. There’s no way they could take on the added burden of taking care of us. We CHOOSE to take care of my mom. I don’t want her in a nursing home and taking care of her is the hardest thing I’ve ever done and I do it gladly. I still say that the waste and fraud in this country is a part of the problem with SS and Medicare. We need every politican regardless of party to be voted OUT the next time around. We need new blood and I have to believe there are some out there that can fix this mess we’re in.
We are in complete and total agreement my friend.
LLS
“Are you pullin’ my leg?” Nope
“Do you really expect your kids to take care of you and your wife?” Yep, but you’re pulling my leg if you think it’s wrong, given that is the way society has existed for at least 4920 of the past 5000 years. The idea of extracting money from strangers started with the Bolsheviks and was imported to the US by FDR.
“Do you mean you will give your SS and Medicare back to the gooberment that forcefully took it for all your working years?” Gladly, providing that it’s the policy of this country. Otherwise I’ll take the money and hand it right to my kids, as it’s their money (and, in fact, their kids’s money) anyway. I have no more claim to it than I have claim to my neighbor’s money.
“Our kids and their spouses both work and live hand to mouth but do contribute to retirement accounts for their future. There’s no way they could take on the added burden of taking care of us.” Oh, they likely could - at least in most cases (don’t know yours, obviously). They would just have to be prepared to do so and adjust their lives accordingly. And even if they can’t finance all of it, they certainly can help, and so can the parents, by living cheaply.
“We CHOOSE to take care of my mom.” Awesome.
“We need every politican regardless of party to be voted OUT the next time around. We need new blood and I have to believe there are some out there that can fix this mess we’re in.” Not enough, it’s our attitude that stealing from future generations is ok that has to change too.
OK, I realize that back in the day families took care of grandma and grandpa and crazy Aunt Rose who they let come out at Christmas time. I realize that SS is the bastard at a family picnic nowadays but it was designed to help people in their last days. I know it all went wrong and Medicare blew up in our faces when it became the financial cow to pay for the war in VietNam.....(feel free to correct me if I’m wrong about that). I still maintain that these two thorns in the sides of many Americans would have succeeded if the crapiticians would have left their dirty, greasy hands off but to deny many Americans what they paid for, again forcefully, and it had worked out that each generation got what THEY paid for and not our kids, it might have been a good thing. I still say it can work for the reasons I’ve mentioned before and I’ll add take away the perks these jerks in WDC have in the Senate and House and that would save millions! They’re not special in any way at any time. They work for us and if they go to that cesspool called WDC with the best of intentions, it sure goes down the crapper real fast when the power bug bites them. Washington needs fixing and if that ever happens, SS and Medicare should work for everyone.
What “free ride”? I don’t get ANYTHINGfrom the Feds Except for national defense . No transfer payments no entitlements etc etc etc. and thanks to federal law I am even a slave on my job where I am forced to give my services for free to anyone who chooses to show up at the door. Double my taxes and I quit working period. The fact that my Jackel fellow citizens have voted themselves Bread and Circuses doesn’t make me any less a slave to day
The bread is rampant welfare and EBT and the circuses are the NFL, NBA etc. Totally agree, we are the new Romans. And not the Roman Republic but the later empire...
“What “free ride”? I don’t get ANYTHINGfrom the Feds Except for national defense . No transfer payments no entitlements etc etc etc. and thanks to federal law I am even a slave on my job where I am forced to give my services for free to anyone who chooses to show up at the door. Double my taxes and I quit working period. The fact that my Jackel fellow citizens have voted themselves Bread and Circuses doesn’t make me any less a slave to day”
Same here...and maybe that’s the end game.
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