Posted on 11/09/2012 10:19:09 AM PST by Jeff Head
“Waver,” you mean. I checked to make sure “waiver” wasn’t a pun, as in “ObamaCare waiver.”
That said, since I couldn’t help myself, I agree. To give up means to stop doing what is right, and to stop fighting for our right to do what is right and to say what is true. I can’t do that.
I do not like the way it turned out,but that is the way the mop flops. But I will be a son of a bitch before I accept or embrace abortion or the homesexual agenda as some have suggested we do. Nor will I accept obama and his beliefs as my President. Whatever that makes me, I will be it.
Ditto.
Borderline...I am afraid you may well be right about losing entoire cities...terrorists could do that...but if the economy really tanks, and transportation and commerce stop, we will lose dozens of cities as they turn into killing fields when there is no food.
I pray we can avoid that...but my point is, either way, we have to do our all to be ready, and we have to keep our faith, so we can be in a position to right it. Either we get another cahnce...with the hill then being all the steeper, or we don;t and it all goes over the cliff.
either way, I am committed to doing all I can to preserving liberty and its blessings for my kids and grandkids and future generations.
Haven't forgotten at all...in fact, if you read my article, my entire point is precisely that we cannot give up, or quit, or throw in the towel because we have to be ready to take the offensive and win.
Amne, my friend, to every bit of that.
I’m with you. You know the most dangerous thing in the world?
An old white man with nothing to loose!
“We must show them that their best interests are served by individual liberty, responsibility, accountability and less government.”
Why? To what end?
This was a nice essay, but has it ever occurred to you that those who oppose us not only disagree with us, they hate us as well?
One of the major strategic mistakes we continue to make is to assume that by some combination of argument or packaging or persuasion, that we can convince the denizens of Sodom that our way is better. They aren’t buying what we’re selling. On Tuesday, we had a stark choice between moderation and radical socialism, between opportunity and a welfare check. The choice was clear and the majority chose radical socialism and a welfare check.
There is no combination of appeals to God, patriotism, nation, decency, logic, altruism, or self-interest that is going to convince people who think that they’re entitled to the fruits of other people’s labor that self-sufficiency is a better path. They. Aren’t. Interested.
At a certain point, Lot had to make the decision: to stay in Sodom and take the consequences, or to follow God and leave Sodom to it’s fate.
“It’s 1934, and we’re Winston Churchill.”
Actually, it’s more like 1917 and we’re the bourgoisie.
There is a group that hate us and all we stand for. Obama knows what he is doing, All those in that poster above in my thread about Marxism are part of that machine.
But there are a lot of Americans who vote who have been taken in...and in order to move forward short of a total train wreck, which I pray we can avoid...but also know it may be too late...we have to educate those people so they understand their true best interst and the ways they are being used. Then they will change their mindset and vote for what is in their best interest. That’s why.
I am not ready to consign 60+ million Americans who voted against the proper principles to hell and view them as mortal enemies.
Those others? Absolutely...and there may not be tens of miliions of them, buth there are a lot of them. Probably number in the high hundreds thousands as a minimum...maybe a million or two at this point.
But they are using the others and we can and should try and reach them. In fact, if we want to defeat them at the ballot box, and, God willing, I still believe we can, we are going to have to find a way to eduate them.
re: “We as a nation made this choice.”
Totally agree with you here.
re: “We prayed, and worked our hearts out, and sought His help...and I believe He gave it...just not in the way we imagine. That’s all.”
I’m with you so far.
re: “He allowed us to make this choice and did not intervene. He has intervened at times in history...but we are not ready for, or His plan does not call for it now.”
Still with you so far.
re: “My point is that whatever case, we have to accept God’s will and work with it and progress from there.”
I accept what happened, but I do not accept that Obama’s winning was necessarily “God’s will”. It might be, but unless He has told you or me through divine revelation, we don’t know if Obama’s win was what God wanted - He allowed it as part of His permissive will, but whether or not He “wanted” Obama and “chose” Obama to be our next president - that I do not know.
re: “He is not molded by our desires, we are modled by His and once we as a people turn to those rightous desires He has for us, we will see progress as a people.”
He is not molded by our desires but He does respond to our free moral choices as He sees fit. We exercise a free moral choice, and, so does God.
re: “In the mean time we do not falter. We continue to work our hearts out for the day that becomes a reality.”
Completely agree with you on this one. Also, Jeff, I hope I don’t sound like a jerk or that I’m trying to attack you, or that I am angry at you. I’m not. I think you are a great American and that you obviously love God and our great country.
Maybe I’m sounding a bit picky, if I do, I don’t mean to be. I just want to be careful with my words regarding God’s will. I think sometimes when we say things like, “God’s in control”, that we need to qualify that a bit because sometimes it sounds like we are saying that whatever happens is God’s will and that every political leader who attains some position was “chosen” by God to be in that position. I just do not believe that. God does allow some people to be placed in positions of leadership by our choice, and does not, for His own purposes, intervene. At the same time, sometimes God DOES choose a particular person to be in a position of leadership by His choice.
An interesting example of this is in the book of 2nd Samuel. I don’t exactly recall the specific chapter, but it is after King Saul has died, and David has returned to Judah and was made King over the people of Judah. We also know at this point that God had anointed David to be the next King over all Israel by the prophet Samuel. However, a man by the name of Abner had his own agenda about all of this and he rebells against God’s clear will that David be king, by encouraging one of Saul’s surviving sons, Ishbosheth, to claim the kingship over the northern tribes comprising what was called “Israel”. You see, Ishbosheth was kind of a weak person and Abner used him as a puppet king while he, Abner, ruled behind the scenes.
Abner even instigated civil war against Judah and David and tried to defeat David to extend Israel’s rule over Judah. It failed because he was fighting against God’s will. My point is, Ishbosheth was crowned king of the people of Israel even though everyone knew that David was called by God to be king. Ishbosheth was rebelling, Abner was rebelling against God’s will. And, it cost them both dearly. Ishbosheth was not supposed to be king of anything - it was against the will of God. God allowed them to rebell, but it did not thwart His ulimate will to make David King over all Israel and Judah - which did occur but only after many people suffered and died because of Abner’s rebellion.
So, I’ve said all this to say that I think we need to be very careful before subscribing God’s will as to why things happen as they do. Also, I think we must be careful when we tell people that “God’s in control” because we might be ascribing some evil act of rebellion to God, when in reality, it was a bad, free moral choice by man. I know that is NOT what you meant, but some people might misunderstand and think you are saying that whatever happens is God’s will and Obama must be the one God wanted us to have as our president. Am I making sense or am I just chasing after nothing?
Borderline,
First, I want to say that I completely understand what you are saying in your cynicism. I vacilate every day since the election between despair and hope. We are all deeply hurting because we are in mourning over the loss of our great nation - like a death of a loved one.
I think Jeff’s point is that giving up is not an option for the true patriot.
Think about what it must have been like at Valley Forge in the winter of 1777. Gen. Washington had no supplies - no food, no warm clothes, no ammunition, and no money to even pay the troops. It is said that you could follow the American army by the blood from their frostbit and frozen feet in the snow. His army was melting away faster than he could replace them through sickness and desertion. The British army was the best trained, the best equipped - literally the super power of the day. There was no hope that we could win.
This was when Thomas Paine coined the phrase “fair-weather” patriot and the phrase, “this was the hour that tried men’s soul’s”.
Borderline, no one is calling you a quiter - you have just been wounded, deeply. I think if you will keep coming back to FR, praying, read your Bible, listen to Rush or Mark Levin, that day by day, slowly maybe, you’ll begin to regain your heart for the republic once again. And, when push comes to shove, you’ll do the right thing.
Tomorrow I may be joining you and digging holes in the basement of despair again, but for today, I’m not going to do that. Hang in there my fellow American. There may be hope yet.
A reminder.
Jeff, both your kindness and thoughtfulness, as always, shows through. The importance of preserving a future for our kids is preeminent. I have preteen kids. And their outlook is grimmer than ever I experienced growing up.
My wife and I own a small business and volunteer at all levels of local services, from assisting in the classroom to sheriff’s SAR, to volunteer EMTs on the local ambulance - all the way down to coaching baseball.
I can do something about things locally. Looks to me like American’s voted to undo America. How do you fight that? In the short term, I personally cannot. I will be part of the force behind renewal, when the day comes. For now, I must *do* positive things. Beating the head on the national wall just left me bloody. Not to mention sick at heart.
Thank you my friend, for your wisdom and heart.
Rick
Sorry, but I won’t vote for another republican for president. Matter of fact I won’t be voting anymore. I live in california. Everything I voted for lost. By a lot!
LOL. That is about his will against evil. Voters who vote for santa will not change for a pep talk.
60 million voted against him but there are 320 million people here. That means about 200 million accept him. About 60 million can’t vote being children, felons and all.
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